Page 3 of 9 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 90 of 260

Thread: 9 AM Press Conference

  1. #61
    Invisible Swordsman DrumNFeather's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Caught Beneath the Landslide
    Posts
    8,766

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Nobody on this board could be a bigger DFU fan than me, but I didn't see this as any kind of symbolic swipe against his popularity or progressive nature. DHO is next in line to be the prophet. Makes total sense to put him in the presidency. Anyone who sees any meaning beyond that is looking to stir up drama.

    That being said, the biggest downside of this is that we will likely get to hear fewer DFU talks in GC. Bummer. DHO talks are a little too legalistic for my tastes.
    It's hard to imagine that he'll just fade into the background. He remains a great ambassador and influence. His worldwide devotional on Sunday is a great example of that. I think we'll see plenty of DFU in the coming months and years.
    "They're good. They've always been good" - David Shaw.

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  2. #62

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by smokymountainrain View Post
    so uh, what were their answers to the LGBT question and the PFS question?
    [YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=u1qL2aWgcJ0[/YOUTUBE]

  3. #63

    Default

    My favorite DHO quote is this: "It's wrong to criticize church leaders even if the criticism is true."

  4. #64
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DrumNFeather View Post
    It's hard to imagine that he'll just fade into the background. He remains a great ambassador and influence. His worldwide devotional on Sunday is a great example of that. I think we'll see plenty of DFU in the coming months and years.
    Absolutely.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  5. #65

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Nobody on this board could be a bigger DFU fan than me, but I didn't see this as any kind of symbolic swipe against his popularity or progressive nature. DHO is next in line to be the prophet. Makes total sense to put him in the presidency. Anyone who sees any meaning beyond that is looking to stir up drama.

    That being said, the biggest downside of this is that we will likely get to hear fewer DFU talks in GC. Bummer. DHO talks are a little too legalistic for my tastes.
    It's happened only once in the last 100 years over 16 data points. And he replaced the guy that's universally known as the most Progressive with the one that's universally known as the most hardliner. And anyone who thinks it means anything is looking to stir up drama? Sorry, disagree.

  6. #66

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Nobody on this board could be a bigger DFU fan than me, but I didn't see this as any kind of symbolic swipe against his popularity or progressive nature. DHO is next in line to be the prophet. Makes total sense to put him in the presidency. Anyone who sees any meaning beyond that is looking to stir up drama.

    That being said, the biggest downside of this is that we will likely get to hear fewer DFU talks in GC. Bummer. DHO talks are a little too legalistic for my tastes.
    I don't see anything nefarious about the change. But if this was a move solely to get DHO ready to be prophet, why not move Eyring out and keep Uchtdorf in? I doubt many people would be upset about that. I suspect that if shaking up the counselors was a deliberate choice to get DHO in, keeping Erying might represent wanting counselors who are more akin to Nelson philosophically. And if Oaks/Erying is closer with Nelson on the LGBT issue, I don't think it's a stretch to consider that it might have played some role in that decision.

  7. #67
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    It's happened only once in the last 100 years over 16 data points. And he replaced the guy that's universally known as the most Progressive with the one that's universally known as the most hardliner. And anyone who thinks it means anything is looking to stir up drama? Sorry, disagree.
    Step off the ledge, Jay. This is the 6th time in the last 100 years.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  8. #68
    Pre-Historic Man
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Allendale County, SC
    Posts
    10,757

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    I don't see anything nefarious about the change. But if this was a move solely to get DHO ready to be prophet, why not move Eyring out and keep Uchtdorf in? I doubt many people would be upset about that. I suspect that if shaking up the counselors was a deliberate choice to get DHO in, keeping Erying might represent wanting counselors who are more akin to Nelson philosophically. And if Oaks/Erying is closer with Nelson on the LGBT issue, I don't think it's a stretch to consider that it might have played some role in that decision.
    It is unlikely that the LDS Church will soften unless Oaks's hardline simply represented doing Monson's work as a designate.
    "Guitar groups are on their way out, Mr Epstein."

    Upon rejecting the Beatles, Dick Rowe told Brian Epstein of the January 1, 1962 audition for Decca, which signed Brian Poole and the Tremeloes instead.

  9. #69
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    I don't see anything nefarious about the change. But if this was a move solely to get DHO ready to be prophet, why not move Eyring out and keep Uchtdorf in? I doubt many people would be upset about that. I suspect that if shaking up the counselors was a deliberate choice to get DHO in, keeping Erying might represent wanting counselors who are more akin to Nelson philosophically. And if Oaks/Erying is closer with Nelson on the LGBT issue, I don't think it's a stretch to consider that it might have played some role in that decision.
    So the whole thing was conspired to get a hardcore anti-LGBT crew in charge? Good grief.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  10. #70
    a day late/a dollar short Sullyute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    2,771

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Certainly the smartest presidency ever to serve.
    True, but also the oldest. Hopefully the prayers of all the members will give them plenty of vim and vigor.
    "Friendship is the grand fundamental principle of Mormonism" - Joseph Smith Jr.

  11. #71

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Step off the ledge, Jay. This is the 6th time in the last 100 years.
    Only once has a previous counselor got dropped out of 16 data points. Hugh B. Brown snubbed by Joseph Fielding Smith. Two if you include Marion G. Romney, but he was not functioning health wise.

  12. #72
    One man.....one pie Moliere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    The Republic of Tejas
    Posts
    20,006

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    Only once has a previous counselor got dropped out of 16 data points. Hugh B. Brown snubbed by Joseph Fielding Smith. Two if you include Marion G. Romney, but he was not functioning health wise.
    "Discipleship is not a spectator sport. We cannot expect to experience the blessing of faith by standing inactive on the sidelines any more than we can experience the benefits of health by sitting on a sofa watching sporting events on television and giving advice to the athletes. And yet for some, “spectator discipleship” is a preferred if not primary way of worshipping." -Pres. Uchtdorf

  13. #73

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    So the whole thing was conspired to get a hardcore anti-LGBT crew in charge? Good grief.
    Um, no. I didn't say that. And I started off by saying I don't suspect anything nefarious. I am suggesting that when a counselor is called, you can't discount shared personality and philosophical considerations. If Oaks and Eyring are closer to Nelson on the LGBT (and other) issues, that might have impacted Nelson leaving Erying in as opposed to keeping Uchtforf.

    It doesn't take a 'conspiracy' to explain at least some of the choices church presidents make. Hell, if it's anything like what we see in the church in general, it isn't hard to fathom that church presidents are also moved by personal preferences.

  14. #74
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    Only once has a previous counselor got dropped out of 16 data points. Hugh B. Brown snubbed by Joseph Fielding Smith. Two if you include Marion G. Romney, but he was not functioning health wise.

    Sorry, I miscounted. Five times.

    Hugh B. Brown, First Counselor to David O. McKay, not retained as a counselor by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Thorpe B. Isaacson and Alvin R. Dyer, Counselors to David O. McKay, not retained as counselors by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Marion G. Romney, First Counselor to Spencer W. Kimball, not retained as a counselor by Ezra Taft Benson
    Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Second Counselor to Thomas S. Monson, not retained as a counselor by Russell M. Nelson

    What is so sacrosanct about being a member of the FP? The prior FP members were selected by a prior president. Each president should have complete discretion in terms of who he selects. And why does the selection of one person have to be interpreted as some kind of insult or repudiation on another person?

    Sorry, but the prog-mo drama on this I am seeing right now on social media makes me want to barf.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  15. #75

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Sorry, I miscounted. Five times.

    Hugh B. Brown, First Counselor to David O. McKay, not retained as a counselor by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Thorpe B. Isaacson and Alvin R. Dyer, Counselors to David O. McKay, not retained as counselors by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Marion G. Romney, First Counselor to Spencer W. Kimball, not retained as a counselor by Ezra Taft Benson
    Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Second Counselor to Thomas S. Monson, not retained as a counselor by Russell M. Nelson

    What is so sacrosanct about being a member of the FP? The prior FP members were selected by a prior president. Each president should have complete discretion in terms of who he selects. And why does the selection of one person have to be interpreted as some kind of insult or repudiation on another person?

    Sorry, but the prog-mo drama on this I am seeing right now on social media makes me want to barf.
    Isaacson and Dyer weren't real counselors. They were assistants to counselors.

  16. #76
    Board eye candy beefytee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Lehi
    Posts
    4,508

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    If Oaks and Eyring are closer to Nelson on the LGBT (and other) issues, that might have impacted Nelson leaving Erying in as opposed to keeping Uchtforf.
    I'm guessing that LGBT issues had very little to do with whom he chose.

  17. #77

    Default

    Loving the nerd-up discussion about the history of counselor calling

  18. #78
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    Isaacson and Dyer weren't real counselors. They were assistants to counselors.
    Meh. Let it go, brother. No way is this the anti-DFU conspiracy some are making it out to be.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  19. #79

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by beefytee View Post
    I'm guessing that LGBT issues had very little to do with whom he chose.
    Perhaps. But would it shock you if a president is influenced by personal preferences also?

  20. #80
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    Loving the nerd-up discussion about the history of counselor calling


    The complete list:
    Counselors in the First Presidency not retained upon reorganization
    John Smith, Assistant Counselor to Joseph Smith, not retained as a counselor by Brigham Young
    Amasa M. Lyman, Assistant Counselor to Joseph Smith, not retained as a counselor by Brigham Young
    John Willard Young, First Counselor to Brigham Young, not retained as a counselor by John Taylor
    Daniel H. Wells, Second Counselor to Brigham Young, not retained as a counselor by John Taylor
    Brigham Young Jr., Lorenzo Snow, and Albert Carrington, Assistant Counselors to Brigham Young, not retained as counselors by John Taylor
    Rudger Clawson, called as Second Counselor to Lorenzo Snow, not retained as a counselor by Joseph F. Smith
    Hugh B. Brown, First Counselor to David O. McKay, not retained as a counselor by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Thorpe B. Isaacson and Alvin R. Dyer, Counselors to David O. McKay, not retained as counselors by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Marion G. Romney, First Counselor to Spencer W. Kimball, not retained as a counselor by Ezra Taft Benson
    Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Second Counselor to Thomas S. Monson, not retained as a counselor by Russell M. Nelson
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  21. #81
    lollygagger hostile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    SLC
    Posts
    5,257

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    Isaacson and Dyer weren't real counselors. They were assistants to counselors.
    Probably cause they were fence sitters in the pre existence
    "You interns are like swallows. You shit all over my patients for six weeks and then fly off."

    "Don't be sorry, it's not your fault. It's my fault for overestimating your competence."

  22. #82

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Meh. Let it go, brother. No way is this the anti-DFU conspiracy some are making it out to be.
    I'll recover. But how is this "no way" an anti-DFU thing? Seems like there's a pretty decent chance this is actually an anti-DFU thing. :s

  23. #83
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jay santos View Post
    I'll recover. But how is this "no way" an anti-DFU thing? Seems like there's a pretty decent chance this is actually an anti-DFU thing. :s
    You have convinced me, Jay. I mean look at all the wonderful strides the church has made on LGBT issues in the last nine years with DFU in the FP! There had to be a backlash coming.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  24. #84

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post


    The complete list:
    Counselors in the First Presidency not retained upon reorganization
    John Smith, Assistant Counselor to Joseph Smith, not retained as a counselor by Brigham Young
    Amasa M. Lyman, Assistant Counselor to Joseph Smith, not retained as a counselor by Brigham Young
    John Willard Young, First Counselor to Brigham Young, not retained as a counselor by John Taylor
    Daniel H. Wells, Second Counselor to Brigham Young, not retained as a counselor by John Taylor
    Brigham Young Jr., Lorenzo Snow, and Albert Carrington, Assistant Counselors to Brigham Young, not retained as counselors by John Taylor
    Rudger Clawson, called as Second Counselor to Lorenzo Snow, not retained as a counselor by Joseph F. Smith
    Hugh B. Brown, First Counselor to David O. McKay, not retained as a counselor by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Thorpe B. Isaacson and Alvin R. Dyer, Counselors to David O. McKay, not retained as counselors by Joseph Fielding Smith
    Marion G. Romney, First Counselor to Spencer W. Kimball, not retained as a counselor by Ezra Taft Benson
    Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Second Counselor to Thomas S. Monson, not retained as a counselor by Russell M. Nelson
    Ohhh man. Nerdgasm here.

  25. #85
    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The heart of the UC
    Posts
    45,347

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    Ohhh man. Nerdgasm here.
    Dude, I totally know how to google stuff on wiki.
    "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
    "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
    "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

  26. #86
    Invisible Swordsman DrumNFeather's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Caught Beneath the Landslide
    Posts
    8,766

    Default

    On Friday, when he spoke at President Monson's funeral, DFU was still referred to as "President." By the time he spoke Sunday night, he was once again called "Elder." According to President Nelson, all of the calling and setting apart happened on Sunday morning...so we should've all seen this coming after the worldwide broadcast. Did nobody watch? The Ex-Mo "Insider" Redditers should've been all over this. Shame.
    "They're good. They've always been good" - David Shaw.

    Well, because he thought it was good sport. Because some men aren't looking for anything logical, like money. They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

  27. #87
    Striving for mediocrity Art Vandelay's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    8,875

    Default

    So much speculation, so many unknowns:

    LaOccam's Razor would suggest: President Nelson selected the two men he felt inspired (was told?) to select as counselors

    Other potential scenarios:
    Dieter or Harriet are not is as good of health as it would appear (i have zero knowledge of this). Releasing him would allow him to spend more time at home.
    President Nelson had the impression the (likely) next prophet needs to experience first hand the administration responsibilities of the FP. RMN and DHO will learn this together and rely heavily on HBE

    Lloyd Christmas possibility:
    President Nelson hates gays and foreigners so much he is willing to make his own life harder to get rid of the beloved Silver Fox.

  28. #88
    It is NOT a monkey! creekster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    The Creek
    Posts
    20,641

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    . . . I don't think it's a stretch to consider that it might have played some role in that decision.
    So this is your position? That it is not a stretch to CONSIDER, that it MIGHT have played SOME role in the decision? I can live with that. Sure I can consider the possibility that it MIGHT have played SOME role in the choice. Maybe. Or, maybe not. But at that level, who cares?


    I think this requires the Forest Gump approach: Stupid is as stupid does. So, let's wait and see what they do. Why get all up in arms now about it? As JL said before, and I agree, the only real drawback I can see right now is that it means fewer opportunities to hear from Uchtdorf.
    Last edited by creekster; 01-16-2018 at 11:45 AM.
    PLesa excuse the tpyos.

  29. #89
    Princeps Inter Pares
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    10,932

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
    So much speculation, so many unknowns:

    LaOccam's Razor would suggest: President Nelson selected the two men he felt inspired (was told?) to select as counselors

    Other potential scenarios:
    Dieter or Harriet are not is as good of health as it would appear (i have zero knowledge of this). Releasing him would allow him to spend more time at home.
    President Nelson had the impression the (likely) next prophet needs to experience first hand the administration responsibilities of the FP. RMN and DHO will learn this together and rely heavily on HBE

    Lloyd Christmas possibility:
    President Nelson hates gays and foreigners so much he is willing to make his own life harder to get rid of the beloved Silver Fox.
    The other one was what President Nelson said: there are specific assignments Elder Uchdorf is specifically intended to perform, and being freed up from administrative duties as a member of the First Presidency will allow him to better serve those functions.
    τὸν ἥλιον ἀνατέλλοντα πλείονες ἢ δυόμενον προσκυνοῦσιν

  30. #90

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by creekster View Post
    So this is your position? That it is not a stretch to CONSIDER, that it MIGHT have played SOME role in the decision? I can live with that. Sure I can consider the possibility thaty it MIGHT have played SOME role in the choice. Maybe. Or, maybe not. But at that level, who cares?
    Personally, my position is that it's likely the LGBT issue played a part in the decision. Nelson believes the November policy was revelation. And Oaks cannot help stop talking about the gays. I think it's clear they are on one side of the spectrum. And it's probably safe to guess that their side will be the church's side for a while. I don't know where on the spectrum Uchtdorf resides. But again, if we are playing the guessing game, I would think he's further left than those guys.

    Who cares is a good question. All of us on this board have at least some interest playing the guessing game where the church will be in the future. If there is agreement in principle (certainly not in extent) that personal preference plays some role in calling counselors, then we have another data point to argue about the future of the church.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •