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  • Originally posted by BlueK View Post
    Uh, Germany would still buy it if the Russians took them over, actually probably even more so. Spoils of war, right?
    No, Germany wouldn't be buying Russian oil at the point... "buying" implies that there isn't a gun pointed at your head.
    "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
    "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
    "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
    GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

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    • Originally posted by Uncle Ted View Post
      No, Germany wouldn't be buying Russian oil at the point... "buying" implies that there isn't a gun pointed at your head.
      Ok, whatever you want to call it. Let them have a little oil and take all their money.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Uncle Ted View Post
        No, Germany wouldn't be buying Russian oil at the point... "buying" implies that there isn't a gun pointed at your head.
        Hey, welcome back.
        "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
        "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
        "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
          Can we have these political discussions without getting personal? We seem to spend more time talking about posters and their moral failings for supporting/not supporting Trump than actual political issues. Come on, folks.
          That would be nice.

          Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
          I haven't seen anyone, even the most ardent Trump haters, claim that he is incapable of ever doing a single good thing. If anyone makes such a claim, I will join you in disagreeing.
          I specifically used "people" instead of "you" in my last paragraph to be clear I wasn't pointing fingers at anyone here. I was more talking about all the things I've seen on social and main-stream media since I posted about it yesterday.The Hammond case is one of the most blatant violations of civil liberty and the 8th Amendment I can think of. I think there are plenty of cases where the 8th amendment is stretched and even broken, particularly in drug-related crimes and the 3-strikes laws, but this was a case where they were already sentenced and then the administration appealed it to make it unduly harsh. On top of all of that, the whole thing was part of a massive extortion effort to force the Hammonds to sell their private property to the government because it lay in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Granted, the Hammonds weren't perfect and they made mistakes, but their sentence was a travesty.

          Trump absolutely did the right thing, and it is either ignored or criticized by Trump-haters across the country. It's depressing when hate consumes people so much that they'd rather let innocent people suffer than admit a bad person actually did a very good thing. It doesn't make him good, just right in this case. In fact, I doubt it would have made his radar had he not been taking so much heat from farmers who are part of his base and very pissed off at him over the tariffs.
          sigpic
          "Outlined against a blue, gray
          October sky the Four Horsemen rode again"
          Grantland Rice, 1924

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          • Originally posted by cowboy View Post
            That would be nice.


            I specifically used "people" instead of "you" in my last paragraph to be clear I wasn't pointing fingers at anyone here. I was more talking about all the things I've seen on social and main-stream media since I posted about it yesterday.The Hammond case is one of the most blatant violations of civil liberty and the 8th Amendment I can think of. I think there are plenty of cases where the 8th amendment is stretched and even broken, particularly in drug-related crimes and the 3-strikes laws, but this was a case where they were already sentenced and then the administration appealed it to make it unduly harsh. On top of all of that, the whole thing was part of a massive extortion effort to force the Hammonds to sell their private property to the government because it lay in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Granted, the Hammonds weren't perfect and they made mistakes, but their sentence was a travesty.

            Trump absolutely did the right thing, and it is either ignored or criticized by Trump-haters across the country. It's depressing when hate consumes people so much that they'd rather let innocent people suffer than admit a bad person actually did a very good thing. It doesn't make him good, just right in this case. In fact, I doubt it would have made his radar had he not been taking so much heat from farmers who are part of his base and very pissed off at him over the tariffs.
            I remember the Bundy events but haven't followed the Hammond pardons. What do you believe are the reasonable, if any, counter-arguments to the pardons? A never Trump argument is not a reasonable counter-argument.
            "Guitar groups are on their way out, Mr Epstein."

            Upon rejecting the Beatles, Dick Rowe told Brian Epstein of the January 1, 1962 audition for Decca, which signed Brian Poole and the Tremeloes instead.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by BlueK View Post
              I'm having a hard time understanding how German businesses buying oil and gas from the most efficient supplier for them should have anything to do with international alliances between Germany the country and the US. It sounds to me more like a rhetorical smokescreen to excuse Trump's attempts to do something Putin really likes which is to stir up trouble in the US relationship with Germany and the rest of Western Europe.
              I guess it depends on how you view Russia. If Russia is now a benign neighbor and merely a trading partner, then sure go with the most efficient. If Russia remains a threat and a geopolitical foe, then getting too much of a strategic resource from them means a dependency that brings real risk to your national security. If it's A, then you have to question the value of NATO (as Walter has), which was setup to defend Western Europe from the Soviet Union and its satellite states. If it's B, then Trump's questioning is valid.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by cowboy View Post
                That would be nice.


                I specifically used "people" instead of "you" in my last paragraph to be clear I wasn't pointing fingers at anyone here. I was more talking about all the things I've seen on social and main-stream media since I posted about it yesterday.The Hammond case is one of the most blatant violations of civil liberty and the 8th Amendment I can think of. I think there are plenty of cases where the 8th amendment is stretched and even broken, particularly in drug-related crimes and the 3-strikes laws, but this was a case where they were already sentenced and then the administration appealed it to make it unduly harsh. On top of all of that, the whole thing was part of a massive extortion effort to force the Hammonds to sell their private property to the government because it lay in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Granted, the Hammonds weren't perfect and they made mistakes, but their sentence was a travesty.

                Trump absolutely did the right thing, and it is either ignored or criticized by Trump-haters across the country. It's depressing when hate consumes people so much that they'd rather let innocent people suffer than admit a bad person actually did a very good thing. It doesn't make him good, just right in this case. In fact, I doubt it would have made his radar had he not been taking so much heat from farmers who are part of his base and very pissed off at him over the tariffs.
                I know this case hits home to you, but I think it pales in comparison the damage our government has done via mandatory minimum sentencing, racial profiling, and drug laws in general. This was an overreach against a rancher. The War on Drugs has devastated countless poor and black people. Yes, Trump did the right thing but it didn't take much courage to pardon some white red-state folks.
                "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                Comment


                • Driving around during the noon hour, I was listening to Fox (!) and was very impressed by Shepard Smith's total takedown of Trump's statements regarding NATO and our allies, pointing out several Trump lies and why NATO is important. It's too bad Trump turns off Fox during the period between Fox and Friends and Hannity, but one hopes he gets the message eventually.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                    I know this case hits home to you, but I think it pales in comparison the damage our government has done via mandatory minimum sentencing, racial profiling, and drug laws in general. This was an overreach against a rancher. The War on Drugs has devastated countless poor and black people. Yes, Trump did the right thing but it didn't take much courage to pardon some white red-state folks.
                    Oregon is red now?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Crockett View Post
                      Oregon is red now?
                      Ha. Touche'.

                      Either way, this will resonate with his rural base.
                      "There is no creature more arrogant than a self-righteous libertarian on the web, am I right? Those folks are just intolerable."
                      "It's no secret that the great American pastime is no longer baseball. Now it's sanctimony." -- Guy Periwinkle, The Nix.
                      "Juilliardk N I ibuprofen Hyu I U unhurt u" - creekster

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                        Ha. Touche'.

                        Either way, this will resonate with his rural base.
                        Hey, you got my hopes up for a minute.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by PaloAltoCougar View Post
                          Driving around during the noon hour, I was listening to Fox (!) and was very impressed by Shepard Smith's total takedown of Trump's statements regarding NATO and our allies, pointing out several Trump lies and why NATO is important. It's too bad Trump turns off Fox during the period between Fox and Friends and Hannity, but one hopes he gets the message eventually.
                          FOX?!?

                          Yeah, I don't know where Drumpf gets the idea that military spending is 4.2% of GDP... it is more like 3.6%:

                          nato.jpg

                          https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmc.../#7e264fde14cf

                          LOL... we should get out of NATO just so we are no longer associated with all these loser countries.
                          "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
                          "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
                          "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
                          GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                            I know this case hits home to you, but I think it pales in comparison the damage our government has done via mandatory minimum sentencing, racial profiling, and drug laws in general. This was an overreach against a rancher. The War on Drugs has devastated countless poor and black people. Yes, Trump did the right thing but it didn't take much courage to pardon some white red-state folks.
                            There are a lot of poor people of any color devastated by the War on Drugs that deserve some pardons.
                            "Guitar groups are on their way out, Mr Epstein."

                            Upon rejecting the Beatles, Dick Rowe told Brian Epstein of the January 1, 1962 audition for Decca, which signed Brian Poole and the Tremeloes instead.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
                              Ha. Touche'.

                              Either way, this will resonate with his rural base.
                              It's a very rural and conservative state outside of Portland and Eugene. Tons of rednecks out in NWC's neighborhood.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by bluegoose View Post
                                It's a very rural and conservative state outside of Portland and Eugene. Tons of rednecks out in NWC's neighborhood.
                                Well, not in my exclusive neighborhood!

                                Bend has a nice nexus of rednecks (east side) and hippies (west side). There certainly is a sizable group that sympathizes with the ranchers in Eastern Oregon. But there's plenty of progressive folks on the other side of the river. Most people play nice and meet in the middle.
                                "...you pointy-headed autopsy nerd. Do you think it's possible for you to post without using words like "hilarious," "absurd," "canard," and "truther"? Your bare assertions do not make it so. Maybe your reasoning is too stunted and your vocabulary is too limited to go without these epithets."
                                "You are an intemperate, unscientific poster who makes light of very serious matters.”
                                - SeattleUte

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