Racism...

[happyone]

Not a big fan.

I wonder why as a country we are still pretty racially insensitive.

Now I am not having this turn into an illegal immigrant thread. I am talking about the way people talk about other ethnicities when they aren't around.

Things I hear in the oil field on a daily basis that get me upset. And Drunk_Tank can verify that I speak my mind when this happens.

The following have no place in society:

Nigger
Porch Monkey
Raghead/Towelhead
Wetback
Spic
Chink
Jap
Slant eye

You forgot Bohunk and Polock for Eastern Europeans. I think these terms will disappear with time.

I think one of the advantages I had growing up as an "Army Brat" was that I grew up with lots of different ethnic groups/races and lived played and went to school with them.

I remember coming back to Utah when my father was overseas and being shocked at how my grandparents and other relatives referred to non whites esp. Hispanics.

[SandYFan]

Today I learned that not acting racist, even if you think that way, because of the negative social pressure against being racist, is not good enough.

http://www.maryrobinettekowal.com/jo...ciety-that-is/

Look, I get the ideal is that no one ever has a racist thought again, but as long as people look different, people will notice these differences.

If we are at a point where the vast majority of people will not ACT racist because society will react negatively, can't that be a win? Why do we have to complain about it?

[Harry Tic]

You forgot Bohunk and Polock for Eastern Europeans. I think these terms will disappear with time.

I think one of the advantages I had growing up as an "Army Brat" was that I grew up with lots of different ethnic groups/races and lived played and went to school with them.

I remember coming back to Utah when my father was overseas and being shocked at how my grandparents and other relatives referred to non whites esp. Hispanics.

I remember referring to kids as "the little nippers" and getting called out on it by a friend with a greater appreciation of the etymology of the term than I had.

[HuskyFreeNorthwest]

Today I learned that not acting racist, even if you think that way, because of the negative social pressure against being racist, is not good enough.

http://www.maryrobinettekowal.com/jo...ciety-that-is/

Look, I get the ideal is that no one ever has a racist thought again, but as long as people look different, people will notice these differences.

If we are at a point where the vast majority of people will not ACT racist because society will react negatively, can't that be a win? Why do we have to complain about it?

No that isn't a win. It is a move in the right direction, but it is like being ahead in the 1st quarter.

[wuapinmon]

Today I learned that not acting racist, even if you think that way, because of the negative social pressure against being racist, is not good enough.

http://www.maryrobinettekowal.com/jo...ciety-that-is/

Look, I get the ideal is that no one ever has a racist thought again, but as long as people look different, people will notice these differences.

If we are at a point where the vast majority of people will not ACT racist because society will react negatively, can't that be a win? Why do we have to complain about it?

I don't think you'll like a really long educative answer, so I'm not going to do it. I've probably said it before here anyway. But, I will say this: when you're part of the center, you don't get to tell the margins what they get to be happy/mad about.

[byu71]

I don't think you'll like a really long educative answer, so I'm not going to do it. I've probably said it before here anyway. But, I will say this: when you're part of the center, you don't get to tell the margins what they get to be happy/mad about.

I think that is an excellent point, truly I do. How do you feel about the margins telling the center how they should behave or think?

[jay santos]

Today I learned that not acting racist, even if you think that way, because of the negative social pressure against being racist, is not good enough.

http://www.maryrobinettekowal.com/jo...ciety-that-is/

Look, I get the ideal is that no one ever has a racist thought again, but as long as people look different, people will notice these differences.

If we are at a point where the vast majority of people will not ACT racist because society will react negatively, can't that be a win? Why do we have to complain about it?

I think the point made in that blog is very insightful. It's a point I've tried to make from time to time. It's a difficult point to make or discuss. And it's easy to come across like an idiot or a racist when you bring it up.

I definitely agree with this concept of two layers of racism. The outward layer is actions, which is most harmful if we violate. ie using racist language, making a hiring decision based on race, etc. But there's another layer, discussed in the blog which has to do with our thoughts and perspective. These are the sum total of the stereotypes we've learned from external sources or tendencies that we've noticed empirically as we relate to different people in our life experience.

I can speak for myself in saying that I think I truly believe I do not commit any outward acts that are racist (or at least very few--and fairly innocuous ones). I'm pretty self aware and I know that's not how I want to act. I also know that stereotypes or preconceived notions, even if accurate, only describe probabilities or tendencies and each person is unique and can not and should not be judged that way.

As for the internal layer, I freely admit I have a lot of racist thoughts and perspectives bouncing around in my head. For example, if in a comedy movie a black guy is dropped in a pool and flounders around, it's funny to me because I have a preconditioned stereotype that black people are disproportionately poor swimmers compared to the general population. If I'm selling a car, and someone is ready to make an offer and they are an older, well dressed Asian male, I am bracing for a tough negotiation. I will do my best not to act outwardly in an offensive way. But these and thousands of other data points are bouncing around in our brains. I think it does nobody any good to pretend these thoughts don't exist and that only the outward actions should be discussed in terms of analyzing today's environment wrt racism.

[byu71]

I think the point made in that blog is very insightful. It's a point I've tried to make from time to time. It's a difficult point to make or discuss. And it's easy to come across like an idiot or a racist when you bring it up.

I definitely agree with this concept of two layers of racism. The outward layer is actions, which is most harmful if we violate. ie using racist language, making a hiring decision based on race, etc. But there's another layer, discussed in the blog which has to do with our thoughts and perspective. These are the sum total of the stereotypes we've learned from external sources or tendencies that we've noticed empirically as we relate to different people in our life experience.

I can speak for myself in saying that I think I truly believe I do not commit any outward acts that are racist (or at least very few--and fairly innocuous ones). I'm pretty self aware and I know that's not how I want to act. I also know that stereotypes or preconceived notions, even if accurate, only describe probabilities or tendencies and each person is unique and can not and should not be judged that way.

As for the internal layer, I freely admit I have a lot of racist thoughts and perspectives bouncing around in my head. For example, if in a comedy movie a black guy is dropped in a pool and flounders around, it's funny to me because I have a preconditioned stereotype that black people are disproportionately poor swimmers compared to the general population. If I'm selling a car, and someone is ready to make an offer and they are an older, well dressed Asian male, I am bracing for a tough negotiation. I will do my best not to act outwardly in an offensive way. But these and thousands of other data points are bouncing around in our brains. I think it does nobody any good to pretend these thoughts don't exist and that only the outward actions should be discussed in terms of analyzing today's environment wrt racism.

I have thoughts that run through my head on occasion. I will stop and think, oh heck what would some liberal columnist, politician or educator think. Would they think I am racist? Then I think, what a bunch of jackasses they are. I am not racist and why do I even have to give this some thought when it is put into my head by like I said, a bunch of people whose thinking I consider assinine a lot of the time.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I have thoughts that run through my head on occasion. I will stop and think, oh heck what would some liberal columnist, politician or educator think. Would they think I am racist? Then I think, what a bunch of jackasses they are. I am not racist and why do I even have to give this some thought when it is put into my head by like I said, a bunch of people whose thinking I consider assinine a lot of the time.

lol @ byu71 for obsessing about liberals.

[Harry Tic]

I'm sure this link has been posted before, but here's an online test designed by Hahhhvaaad researchers that makes use of your reaction time in cognitively processing certain conceptual terms when paired with racial distractors. It's supposed to provide a useful measure of the degree of unconscious bias you may harbor.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/

It's been a while since I took it, but the results were interesting and, in my case, unexpected.

[frank ryan]

I'm sure this link has been posted before, but here's an online test designed by Hahhhvaaad researchers that makes use of your reaction time in cognitively processing certain conceptual terms when paired with racial distractors. It's supposed to provide a useful measure of the degree of unconscious bias you may harbor.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/

It's been a while since I took it, but the results were interesting and, in my case, unexpected.

I went there and took a test about whether or not I hated vegetables.

[SandYFan]

I don't think you'll like a really long educative answer, so I'm not going to do it. I've probably said it before here anyway. But, I will say this: when you're part of the center, you don't get to tell the margins what they get to be happy/mad about.

Racist.

EDIT: To clarify, I didn't tell anyone what to be happy/mad about. But you telling me I can't do something because of the color of my skin is, by very definition, racist.

Also: We will never, ever achieve a point where racism does not exist, either openly or in the hearts of people. Ever.

[SeattleUte]

Murder. I'm not a fan. I hate it.

[YOhio]

Murder. I'm not a fan. I hate it.

Same here.

[wuapinmon]

Racist.

EDIT: To clarify, I didn't tell anyone what to be happy/mad about. But you telling me I can't do something because of the color of my skin is, by very definition, racist.

Also: We will never, ever achieve a point where racism does not exist, either openly or in the hearts of people. Ever.

I'm talking about the center. If you moved somewhere where you were on the margins, you would not be the center. Think about it like this; you're Mormon. If you're in Utah, you rule. If you're in South Carolina, you're odd, Other, strange, weird. You don't believe in Jesus. You're going to hell. You can't get elected to public office. You often have issues with more centrist-thinking people about many things. If I move to Utah, I'm part of the crowd, and the Baptist is the fish out of water. If a Baptist is in Utah, I can't rightly tell them to get over their treatment, in the same way that a Baptist telling me something about how I should feel is going to get a string of vulgarity back from me. Race is but one margin. We can all be marginalized.

I think that is an excellent point, truly I do. How do you feel about the margins telling the center how they should behave or think?

I rarely hear the margins calling for anything beyond equality, acceptance, and peace. There are exceptions like the Black Panthers, but they've gone the way of all armed rebellion without popular support.