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What is going to come of Obamacare?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Color Me Badd Fan View Post
    This Gallup poll suggests that now that people have a better understanding of what costs are associated with providing everyone with healthcare (or that the idea is seriously being considered), people don't much like it.

    And again, just imagine what will happen if 50 million people find out they're getting booted off their insurance.

    http://www.gallup.com/poll/165917/ma...4kcgKA.twitter
    So Pelosi was right... The bill had to be passed so folks could figure it out "away from the fog of the controversy."

    "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
    "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
    "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
    GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Goatnapper'96 View Post
      Nothing moves people towards the conservative camp better than real life experience. One of the biggest problems I think liberals have is I believe the personality types drawn to the nuts and bolts of things tend to be more conservative. One problem I think conservatives have is the people drawn to flowery branding and messaging tend to be liberal. We are ending up with liberals winning the messaging wars, getting the votes, until they ineptly roll out crap and then have this faith inspiring look of "WTF just happened?" when it all comes tumbling down. The President of the United States indicated in a presser that he was surprised by the rollout of his healthcare exchanges. I am not talking about his lying about being surprised people's insurance was cancelled, that was part of the political goal to keep his exchanges afloat. I am talking about the laughingstock of his company's most important rollout of his tenure as CEO. He really did not know that was going to happen. I am sure he is busy hanging out with the gals from the View and whatnot, but honestly he is just not up to the task of being in charge of this type of stuff. But the flowery prose and promises of shaingra-la that facilitated him getting there were very comforting to many people, I suppose. In any event I think those people have been shaken back to being American. In the President's hope is a method pocket rest assured these people have short memories. I wonder how he polls now for feeling the pain of the middle class or whatever stupid shit our pollsters ask that end up saying more about how stupid we are than about the President.

      http://www.politico.com/story/2013/1...004.html?hp=l3
      One of the more bipartisan critiques that has emerged out of this is how on earth did it not occur to Obama to hire one man or woman as a CEO over this project? In hindsight, it was an astonishing omission. I get the impression that he really doesn't have any heavy hitters in the White House, these are people that have done well in an idealogical/theoretical bubble but are clueless at actually executing things.

      Look no further than to what's happened to our foreign policy. Obama is utterly clueless to the pitfalls of stiffing your friends and trying to embrace your enemies and how to actually pull off bringing a country into the fold. His interactions with Russia, Syria and Iran don't exactly compare favorably to Nixon going to China.
      Part of it is based on academic grounds. Among major conferences, the Pac-10 is the best academically, largely because of Stanford, Cal and UCLA. “Colorado is on a par with Oregon,” he said. “Utah isn’t even in the picture.”

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Color Me Badd Fan View Post
        One of the more bipartisan critiques that has emerged out of this is how on earth did it not occur to Obama to hire one man or woman as a CEO over this project? In hindsight, it was an astonishing omission. I get the impression that he really doesn't have any heavy hitters in the White House, these are people that have done well in an idealogical/theoretical bubble but are clueless at actually executing things.

        Look no further than to what's happened to our foreign policy. Obama is utterly clueless to the pitfalls of stiffing your friends and trying to embrace your enemies and how to actually pull off bringing a country into the fold. His interactions with Russia, Syria and Iran don't exactly compare favorably to Nixon going to China.
        Isn't Kathleen Sebelius, as HHS Secretary, the CEO of the project?
        "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy; its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill


        "I only know what I hear on the news." - Dear Leader

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Color Me Badd Fan View Post
          It's going to prevent him from passing anything of substance in the Congress unless it's essentially a conservative idea, like welfare reform in 1996. But we'll never see something like that out of Barack Obama.

          What we will see is virtually unprecedented abuses of administrative power and ignoring of statutory law in favor of administrative fiat. It will be done with the cynical mindset that the Supreme Court won't be able to reign him in before the end of his term or before the cause of action is rendered moot due to the temporary nature of the original action. A case in point is what Obama did on Thursday. The insurance companies are placed in an impossible position and even if there were something concrete with Obama's administrative fix (I'm skeptical that there are any teeth to it), there's no way the courts could scale back what he did because it's only lasting for one year.

          Obamacare will eventually totally fail in its current state. The only way it will be saved is with administrative shenanigans which may happen through the risk-corridor provisions in the statute/regs. It's lawless and damaging to the structure of government. That will be the legacy of the Obama Administration.
          We've been seeing this for five years now.
          "Remember to double tap"

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          • #20
            According to this ABC News/Washington Post poll, Mitt was 12 months too early:

            Botched ACA Rollout Hammers Obama; Job Disapproval Reaches a Career High

            Registered voters divide numerically in Mitt Romney's favor, 49-45 percent, if they had a mulligan for the 2012 presidential election. While the difference between the two is within the poll's error margin, Obama's support is 6 points below his actual showing a year ago.
            The video montage at the link is pretty devastating.
            “There is a great deal of difference in believing something still, and believing it again.”
            ― W.H. Auden


            "God made the angels to show His splendour - as He made animals for innocence and plants for their simplicity. But men and women He made to serve Him wittily, in the tangle of their minds."
            -- Robert Bolt, A Man for All Seasons


            "It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye."
            --Antoine de Saint-Exupery

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by LA Ute View Post
              According to this ABC News/Washington Post poll, Mitt was 12 months too early:

              Botched ACA Rollout Hammers Obama; Job Disapproval Reaches a Career High

              The video montage at the link is pretty devastating.

              This is only a small set back for Obama. Once the website is working and Obamacare is saving families like mine $2,500/year in healthcare insurance costs his numbers will be back. There is even lots of talk now about keeping my old plan and doctor now... just like Barack promised.

              Your good congress woman from California set the record straight on the news last Sunday on Meet the Press....

              "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
              "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
              "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
              GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Uncle Ted View Post
                This is only a small set back for Obama. Once the website is working and Obamacare is saving families like mine $2,500/year in healthcare insurance costs his numbers will be back. There is even lots of talk now about keeping my old plan and doctor now... just like Barack promised.

                Your good congress woman from California set the record straight on the news last Sunday on Meet the Press....

                I shouldn't be, but I am stunned at how far she is willing to carry through with this charade. Sarah Palin and Michele Bachmann get pounded for being stupid, but those two look like Einstein compared to Nancy Pelosi.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by imanihonjin View Post
                  I shouldn't be, but I am stunned at how far she is willing to carry through with this charade. Sarah Palin and Michele Bachmann get pounded for being stupid, but those two look like Einstein compared to Nancy Pelosi.
                  She can't back away from this. She was the Speaker from the start of this tremendous failure. I'm just waiting for her to say "See? I was right. We had to pass this to find out what was in it."
                  "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy; its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." - Winston Churchill


                  "I only know what I hear on the news." - Dear Leader

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Vermont's "Everybody in, nobody out" single payer healthcare insurance...

                    [...]
                    All but ignored in the multitude of media coverage about the ACA and its problems, Vermont has become the first state in the union to pass a single-payer universal health care law for its residents. It has a snappy slogan: Everybody in, nobody out.


                    The system will be fully operational by 2017, funded by Medicare, Medicaid, federal money for the ACA given to Vermont, and a slight increase in taxes. Everyone will be able to go to any doctor or hospital in the state free of charge. No plans to figure out, no insurance forms to sweat over, no gotchas.

                    Dr. William Hsaio, the Harvard health care economist who helped craft health systems in seven countries, was Vermont’s adviser. He estimates that Vermont will save 25 percent per capita over the current system in administrative costs and other savings. Employers will suddenly be free to give raises to their employees instead of paying for increasingly expensive health benefits. All hospitals and health-care providers in Vermont will be nonprofit. Medicare recipients will no longer need to wade through an inch-thick book to choose supplemental plans and sort out other complex options in their Medicare enrollment.
                    [...]
                    So, what’s the weather like in Burlington or Montpelier, Vermont?
                    http://www.minnpost.com/community-vo...ffers-ray-hope

                    So if Obamacare is too much then there is still an option... move to Vermont.
                    "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
                    "I honestly believe saying someone is a smart lawyer is damning with faint praise. The smartest people become engineers and scientists." -SU.
                    "Yet I still see wisdom in that which Uncle Ted posts." -creek.
                    GIVE 'EM HELL, BRIGHAM!

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/...08020624280740
                      Do Your Damnedest In An Ostentatious Manner All The Time!
                      -General George S. Patton

                      I'm choosing to mostly ignore your fatuity here and instead overwhelm you with so much data that you'll maybe, just maybe, realize that you have reams to read on this subject before you can contribute meaningfully to any conversation on this topic.
                      -DOCTOR Wuap

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Health insurance for my family is going up nearly $300 per year. Not the end of the world, but considering what I already pay for health insurance, pretty ridiculous.
                        Prepare to put mustard on those words, for you will soon be consuming them, along with this slice of humble pie that comes direct from the oven of shame set at gas mark “egg on your face”! -- Moss

                        There are three rules that I live by: never get less than twelve hours sleep; never play cards with a guy who has the same first name as a city; and never get involved with a woman with a tattoo of a dagger on her body. Now you stick to that, and everything else is cream cheese. --Coach Finstock

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Donuthole View Post
                          Health insurance for my family is going up nearly $300 per year. Not the end of the world, but considering what I already pay for health insurance, pretty ridiculous.
                          Mine is going up that much every quarter. But at least I have vision and dental coverage now

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                          • #28
                            I've seen a lot of recent news reports that seem to indicate that Obamacare isn't quite turning out to be the success that the president promised. Something to keep in mind.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Art Vandelay View Post
                              Mine is going up that much every quarter. But at least I have vision and dental coverage now
                              In our meeting, the insurance rep told us our premiums aren't going up at all, which is a pretty rare for the companies he's worked with in the SL Valley this year.

                              I imagine the higher ups are eating a lot of the cost for us.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by YOhio View Post
                                I've seen a lot of recent news reports that seem to indicate that Obamacare isn't quite turning out to be the success that the president promised. Something to keep in mind.
                                The keys to remember are that the Republicans are partly to blame. Even though they did not vote for it and kicked and screamed that it would be a failure (I recall back when President Obama fancied his approval ratings as more in common with Clinton than Dubya he went around guffawing that they were the "party of NO!") it is important to remember that their think tanks came up with some of these ideas such as exchanges and the individual mandate.
                                Do Your Damnedest In An Ostentatious Manner All The Time!
                                -General George S. Patton

                                I'm choosing to mostly ignore your fatuity here and instead overwhelm you with so much data that you'll maybe, just maybe, realize that you have reams to read on this subject before you can contribute meaningfully to any conversation on this topic.
                                -DOCTOR Wuap

                                Comment

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