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Thread: Mormons in the News

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    Members Only Dwight Schr-ute's Avatar
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    Default Mormons in the News

    I thought this would get a good miscellaneous thread to catch all those interesting stories about news worthy Mormon that aren't interesting enough for their own threads.

    I'll start. A member of my stake presidency (attorney) and a member of one of the bishoprics within the stake (judge) are making the news after both having removed themselves from a big insurance case. Why? The prosecution objected due to the fact that the attorney would have influence over the judge due to his elevated church status.

    Does this happen in Utah much?

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    My Mic Sounds Nice falafel's Avatar
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    I didn't know Doug Smith was a Mo. (Also, Gerry Gillock is a plaintiff's attorney, not a prosecutor).
    Ain't it like most people, I'm no different. We love to talk on things we don't know about.

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    Members Only Dwight Schr-ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by falafel View Post
    I didn't know Doug Smith was a Mo. (Also, Gerry Gillock is a plaintiff's attorney, not a prosecutor).
    And I didn't know he was a judge!

    Seattle. That guy is deserving of and has been granted his own thread. Keep up!


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    Brother Parker made some news tonight. 27/9
    Last edited by clackamascoug; 11-13-2013 at 10:26 AM.

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    Is Mesquite the next Waco? Cattle battle going down here in Nevada!

    http://m.reviewjournal.com/news/ranc...cattle-roundup

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Is Mesquite the next Waco? Cattle battle going down here in Nevada!

    http://m.reviewjournal.com/news/ranc...cattle-roundup
    Let us hope not, but the Feds have mismanaged it so far.

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    Members Only Dwight Schr-ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Topper View Post
    Let us hope not, but the Feds have mismanaged it so far.
    Agreed. How this has taken 20 years is maddening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Agreed. How this has taken 20 years is maddening.
    The Feds do a poor job of land use management, but especially in the area of grazing rights and water rights.

    There is a case in US District Court in Reno that controls certain water rights which has dragged on since 1934. Its case number is D-185. It will outlive you and me.

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    Bald not naked Pelado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Is Mesquite the next Waco? Cattle battle going down here in Nevada!

    http://m.reviewjournal.com/news/ranc...cattle-roundup
    Does he have any legitimate gripe with regards to the land-use changes he refused to accept 20 years ago?
    "I think it was King Benjamin who said 'you sorry ass shitbags who have no skills that the market values also have an obligation to have the attitude that if one day you do in fact win the PowerBall Lottery that you will then impart of your substance to those without.'"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Is Mesquite the next Waco? Cattle battle going down here in Nevada!

    http://m.reviewjournal.com/news/ranc...cattle-roundup
    How about that? I am related to some of those people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelado View Post
    Does he have any legitimate gripe with regards to the land-use changes he refused to accept 20 years ago?
    Here is an interesting article. Sounds like things are getting out of hand there.. Also, based on the article it states this Bundy family has been ranching in this area since the 1870's, and the annexed part of the county/land for the purpose of a desert tortoise..

    http://freebeacon.com/issues/last-man-standing/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    How about that? I am related to some of those people.
    Thanks for the info, Viking.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YOhio View Post
    Thanks for the info, Viking.
    Watch yourself, I bet he's going to tell you to meet up and see his Discover card if you don't back down.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuskyFreeNorthwest View Post
    Watch yourself, I bet he's going to tell you to meet up and see his Discover card if you don't back down.
    JL always pays for my lunch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YOhio View Post
    JL always pays for my lunch.
    He throws his cronies a bone every so often. That way his dictatorship will always have support.
    Get confident, stupid
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    Members Only Dwight Schr-ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    How about that? I am related to some of those people.
    You can't help but get your hands into Nevada politics, can you?

    I just don't get what sort of position this guy thinks he has, but maybe I just don't understand range laws very well. Seems like once the desert tortoise was listed and this area was confirmed as part of the tortoise's native range, the Feds updated their regulations, Bundy disagreed and stopped making his payments. That should clearly forfeit his right to the land, regardless of how long his family has been using it. I think the fact that even the Nevada Cattlemen's Association is distancing themselves from this guy is very telling.

    All I know is that I've been working with native fishes in the area since 2000 and this guy's cattle have absolutely trashed the lower Virgin River. In fact, there's a chance that it was one of the Bundy's that drew a gun on us 10 years ago while we worked our way down the river. I'll be glad to see them gone. I just hope everything stays peaceful.

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    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YOhio View Post
    Thanks for the info, Viking.
    How dare you make jokes when our rights and freedoms are hanging by a thread? God help us when the Bureau of Land Management thinks they actually have the power to manage land. Next thing you know, the EPA will want to protect the environment. Wake up, America!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    How dare you make jokes when our rights and freedoms are hanging by a thread? God help us when the Bureau of Land Management thinks they actually have the power to manage land. Next thing you know, the EPA will want to protect the environment. Wake up, America!
    We don't really have any problems with the BLM/EPA in Texas for some reason… I don't know what your relatives are b*tching about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ted View Post
    We don't really have any problems with the BLM/EPA in Texas for some reason… I don't know what your relatives are b*tching about.

    This should be included in the "What's Right with Texas" thread as well..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    You can't help but get your hands into Nevada politics, can you?

    I just don't get what sort of position this guy thinks he has, but maybe I just don't understand range laws very well. Seems like once the desert tortoise was listed and this area was confirmed as part of the tortoise's native range, the Feds updated their regulations, Bundy disagreed and stopped making his payments. That should clearly forfeit his right to the land, regardless of how long his family has been using it. I think the fact that even the Nevada Cattlemen's Association is distancing themselves from this guy is very telling.

    All I know is that I've been working with native fishes in the area since 2000 and this guy's cattle have absolutely trashed the lower Virgin River. In fact, there's a chance that it was one of the Bundy's that drew a gun on us 10 years ago while we worked our way down the river. I'll be glad to see them gone. I just hope everything stays peaceful.
    My family has a few ranches in Nevada and uses a lot of BLM land for grazing. My dad's not a big fan of the BLM, but he sides with it on this matter.
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    Here's another hot Nevada news story with some Mormon involvement. As some may be aware, Clark County is one of the most liberal jurisdictions in the U.S. when it comes to personal injury awards. The initial inclination is to link this with Nevada's seemingly liberal politics, (Nevada is actually a lot more conservative than our Senate and Congressional elects woudl lead you to believe) but there is a lot more to it than that. Nevada is one of the few places to elect judges, and rumors of judges being in the pocket of some of the big PI players have been around since I came here 10 years ago. I've certainly experienced and/or witnesses some very curious rulings before certain judges who always give the benefit of the doubt (and requested relief) to the Plaintiff, especially when the Plaintiff is represented by particular firms.

    (Sidenote: Recent judicial corruption includes a
    "medical mafia" scandal here 5-6 years ago which involved some LDS attorneys (including BYU and BYU Law grads) and a system designed to unnecessarily trump up medical bills to generate higher verdicts and settlements. Some of the doctors took hits and entered plea bargains, but the lawyers involved got off pretty much free and clear.)

    This last week, a local district court candidate filed an affidavit claiming he was approached by a political consultant (married to one of our recently-elected judges, and an agent of sorts for about a dozen local judges) who offered to have the judicial candidate's entire campaign paid for by the biggest PI name in town if he would withdraw from running against one (very PI-friendly) judge and run against another (much more fair, IMO) judge. The judicial candidate requested that the promise be texted to him by the attorney, which the PI attorney (wisely) refused to do.

    Betsy Gonzales is a judge who Sheldon Addelson is allegedly trying to get ousted for sanctioning him $25,000. She is mentioned in this article, is a Mormon, and therefore istechnically a Mormon in the news. Her story, IMO, is much less interesting than that of the high-powered PI attorney who is essentially trying to buy our local judiciary.


    http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/la...udiciary-races
    Last edited by Donuthole; 04-09-2014 at 09:00 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    You can't help but get your hands into Nevada politics, can you?

    I just don't get what sort of position this guy thinks he has, but maybe I just don't understand range laws very well. Seems like once the desert tortoise was listed and this area was confirmed as part of the tortoise's native range, the Feds updated their regulations, Bundy disagreed and stopped making his payments. That should clearly forfeit his right to the land, regardless of how long his family has been using it. I think the fact that even the Nevada Cattlemen's Association is distancing themselves from this guy is very telling.

    All I know is that I've been working with native fishes in the area since 2000 and this guy's cattle have absolutely trashed the lower Virgin River. In fact, there's a chance that it was one of the Bundy's that drew a gun on us 10 years ago while we worked our way down the river. I'll be glad to see them gone. I just hope everything stays peaceful.
    Were you working on public land? What was he thinking when he drew a gun on you? And does that happen a lot in your line of work?

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    Trump-hating snowflake Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ted View Post
    We don't really have any problems with the BLM/EPA in Texas for some reason… I don't know what your relatives are b*tching about.
    Figures. Not much land in Texas is worth protecting for the public.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    Were you working on public land? What was he thinking when he drew a gun on you? And does that happen a lot in your line of work?
    Yep. We were in the channel, which is public land. But I'm pretty sure that everything else around us was BLM land anyway. As this situation has highlighted, bpeople tend to get possessive of property they think they own, and likely due to the consequences of such an attitude, become quite suspicious of any one else that shows up. Didn't matter that I worked for a private consulting firm at the time, "we were doing government work, so that made us government." Having a gun pulled on us was rare, but suspicion and resistance are pretty common. Land and water are tradition out here. Tradition that many will always be ready to battle over. I think something happens to otherwise good people when they've spent too much time isolated in the desert.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Figures. Not much land in Texas is worth protecting for the public.
    Ted JL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northwestcoug View Post
    Were you working on public land? What was he thinking when he drew a gun on you? And does that happen a lot in your line of work?
    I can't speak for Schrute or his line of work, but I can tell you cattle rancher are some of the most paranoid sons of bitches in the Texas oilpatch. They're the folks you negotiate a surface use agreement with (when you don't have to by terms of the lease), pay them a sum of money, but will subsequently block our access roads with pickup trucks and armed ranchhands until we fork over additional money.
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    My Mic Sounds Nice falafel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donuthole View Post
    Betsy Gonzales is a judge who Sheldon Addelson is allegedly trying to get ousted for sanctioning him $25,000. She is mentioned in this article, is a Mormon, and therefore istechnically a Mormon in the news. Her story, IMO, is much less interesting than that of the high-powered PI attorney who is essentially trying to buy our local judiciary.

    http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/la...udiciary-races
    Isn't Besty Gonzales "Mormon" the way that Juliana Hough is "Mormon"?
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    It amazes me that there's still that attitude out there. Oregon had it's share of cattle/sheep herder skirmishes, with a few lynchings here and there. But that was a century ago.

  30. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    I just don't get what sort of position this guy thinks he has, but maybe I just don't understand range laws very well. Seems like once the desert tortoise was listed and this area was confirmed as part of the tortoise's native range, the Feds updated their regulations, Bundy disagreed and stopped making his payments. That should clearly forfeit his right to the land, regardless of how long his family has been using it. I think the fact that even the Nevada Cattlemen's Association is distancing themselves from this guy is very telling.

    All I know is that I've been working with native fishes in the area since 2000 and this guy's cattle have absolutely trashed the lower Virgin River. In fact, there's a chance that it was one of the Bundy's that drew a gun on us 10 years ago while we worked our way down the river. I'll be glad to see them gone. I just hope everything stays peaceful.
    I've followed this thread while I've been working the last few days, and made a special trip into the house to type a reply. Having a working relationship with both the BLM and the Forest Service, and having worked as a consultant on a range battle in Wyoming that ultimately went to the SCOTUS (my part in it was negligible, but I came to be very familiar with the case,) I will say that the arguments for both sides boil down to two things: 1) an issue of state's rights/individual liberties versus federal authority (ie, do the feds have to adhere to state statutes and eminent domain laws with their management plans,) and 2) The perception (and often reality) of the feds promoting a more radical agenda through the Trojan Horse of 'stewardship'.

    Regarding the first issue, most western states are 'fence out' states, meaning that if you want to keep the neighbor's cattle off your property, you need to build a fence. Many states, including Wyoming, have statutes that require both neighbors to share the cost of a new fence if one landowner initiates the intent to build a fence. These laws were designed to make both landowners share the responsibility of containing cattle that were there way before nesting homesteaders started moving in a squatting on rangeland controlled by the cattlemen. The feds have thumbed their nose at these statutes, and basically told all cattlemen that they will be fined for trespassing if stray cattle wander onto grazing allotment. Some people see this as the feds thumbing their noses at the states and making their own rules, which doesn't sit well with locals.

    Personal rights, and eminent domain also come into play with this discussion. The Taylor Grazing act was specifically written to protect the tenure of ranchers who had been grazing lands for decades on the public range. It has evolved, much like the rent controlled real estate of New York, into grazing permits become assets that can be bought and sold. There is a high discount rate due to uncertainty surrounding Federal direction, but the permits have value nonetheless. When the BLM swoops in and reduces the number of cattle that can be run on a permit, the action, in my mind, constitutes a taking that should be reimbursed through eminent domain. The issue is complicated by the fact that many permits have a substantial amount of acreage that I run cattle on, with all of the water being located on private land. Despite this, the BLM controls how many animals I can run, and what dates I can turn in and come home. In some cases, the BLM has even threatened to cancel permits if landowners didn't grant them access to the private lands in the allotments. In one case in particular, BLM employees resorted to harassment and vandalism to try to force the issue. None of this applies to the case in Nevada, where Bundy clearly vacated his right to a permit by discontinuing payment.

    Unfortunately, the bigger issue when in comes to federal land management is the sue and settle culture of the environmental lobby. At best, this keeps the good federal employees more interested about avoiding a lawsuit with Western Watershed than actually managing the land for productive use. At worst, it puts the feds in bed with Western Watershed and its radical environmental cronies, who care little about land stewardship, to achieve the ultimate goal of eliminating livestock from federal lands. When they aren't suing over permit renewals, these groups are creating bogus claims of endangered species to try to control both private and federal lands. A case in point is the potential listing of the sage grouse as a threatened species. There is nothing threatened about this species, as evident of the fact that Montana and Wyoming have hunting seasons on them to control the population. Still, because listing proposals have to be based on very little, if any science, sage grouse listing has become an issue, and the burden is on us as ranchers working with the Fish and Wildlife to prove that the species isn't threatened in order to keep them from essentially taking our private land and public grazing permits. That may have been the case with the desert tortoise, but true or not, the tactic has been used for frivolous purposes so often that most western people will take the cynical view.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    How dare you make jokes when our rights and freedoms are hanging by a thread? God help us when the Bureau of Land Management thinks they actually have the power to manage land. Next thing you know, the EPA will want to protect the environment. Wake up, America!
    The BLM and Forest spend far less time trying to manage land than they do trying to cover their asses from lawsuits by the radical environmental movement. We currently have good people in our BLM and Forest Service offices, but our meetings with them spend 80% of the time figuring out how we can make improvements without being sued by Western Watershed and 20% of our time identifying actual management concerns. I had to hire my own counsel and private range consultent this year just to help our BLM range con navigate the permit renewal to avoid triggering a lawsuit.

    But your sarcasm has merit. Guys like Bundy make ranchers look like radical freemen, an give those of us who try to improve the range a bad name.

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