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  1. #391
    Senior Member Katy Lied's Avatar
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    Anyway, the roommate gets back from her confession with the bishop. (I heard this from my friend, not the porn consuming roommate, so I don't know what her state of mind was.) She got no discipline. Nothing. Not even a suggestion to stop taking the sacrament.

    When she confessed, she broke down and cried and said that because she was so unattractive, she had no hopes of getting married, so she would never know what a physical relationship between a man and a woman would be like, and porn movies were the only way she could satisfy her curiosity. It was the closest she would ever get to having sex with a real husband. And why couldn't she have a husband? It was promised in her patriarchal blessing that she would be married with many, many children, but no priesthood holder wanted to date her. She was a worthy temple rec holder, why can't she get eternal temple blessings from marriage?

    That was it. Nothing was said about how she probably wasn't a recommend holder at that moment. Nothing about how if she were curious, why didn't she just watch one movie? Why 3 movies a night for 3 months? No counseling about how porn does not depict a loving relationship between two worthy people striving for exaltation. No details demanded of her about exactly what type of porn she was watching. Just "Dont do it again."

    Would an RM man in his middle 20s get the same treatment?

  2. #392
    Senior Member byu71's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post

    Would an RM man in his middle 20s get the same treatment?
    No, but I think a man in his 60's would.

  3. #393
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Anyway, the roommate gets back from her confession with the bishop. (I heard this from my friend, not the porn consuming roommate, so I don't know what her state of mind was.) She got no discipline. Nothing. Not even a suggestion to stop taking the sacrament.

    When she confessed, she broke down and cried and said that because she was so unattractive, she had no hopes of getting married, so she would never know what a physical relationship between a man and a woman would be like, and porn movies were the only way she could satisfy her curiosity. It was the closest she would ever get to having sex with a real husband. And why couldn't she have a husband? It was promised in her patriarchal blessing that she would be married with many, many children, but no priesthood holder wanted to date her. She was a worthy temple rec holder, why can't she get eternal temple blessings from marriage?

    That was it. Nothing was said about how she probably wasn't a recommend holder at that moment. Nothing about how if she were curious, why didn't she just watch one movie? Why 3 movies a night for 3 months? No counseling about how porn does not depict a loving relationship between two worthy people striving for exaltation. No details demanded of her about exactly what type of porn she was watching. Just "Dont do it again."

    Would an RM man in his middle 20s get the same treatment?
    Only if he was as unattractive as the good sister you've described.
    "I think it was King Benjamin who said 'you sorry ass shitbags who have no skills that the market values also have an obligation to have the attitude that if one day you do in fact win the PowerBall Lottery that you will then impart of your substance to those without.'"
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  4. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Anyway, the roommate gets back from her confession with the bishop. (I heard this from my friend, not the porn consuming roommate, so I don't know what her state of mind was.) She got no discipline. Nothing. Not even a suggestion to stop taking the sacrament.

    When she confessed, she broke down and cried and said that because she was so unattractive, she had no hopes of getting married, so she would never know what a physical relationship between a man and a woman would be like, and porn movies were the only way she could satisfy her curiosity. It was the closest she would ever get to having sex with a real husband. And why couldn't she have a husband? It was promised in her patriarchal blessing that she would be married with many, many children, but no priesthood holder wanted to date her. She was a worthy temple rec holder, why can't she get eternal temple blessings from marriage?

    That was it. Nothing was said about how she probably wasn't a recommend holder at that moment. Nothing about how if she were curious, why didn't she just watch one movie? Why 3 movies a night for 3 months? No counseling about how porn does not depict a loving relationship between two worthy people striving for exaltation. No details demanded of her about exactly what type of porn she was watching. Just "Dont do it again."

    Would an RM man in his middle 20s get the same treatment?
    yes

  5. #395
    Liberal Feminazi Pheidippides's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigPiney View Post
    yes
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  6. #396
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    There is definitely a double standard. I should put this in the punography thread, but this is my last post on this.

    I had a friend who rented a house and had roommates, but all the bills were in her name. She came to me for help deciphering her cable bill, because in the past 3 months it had blown up to hundreds of dollars a month. I called the cable company and they told me someone in the house was renting pay per view porn movies at night, and the activity log showed that some nights 2-3 movies were watched, for hours at a time. My friend determined that one of her roommates, a stand up returned missionary, was watching porn late at night with the volume turned way down. This had been happening for 3 months, and the roommate was hiding the cable bill when it arrived. (My friend was not the most prompt utility payer.)

    So about 90 days, 3-5 nights per week, sometimes 2-3 movies a night. That sounds like an addiction to me. My friend confronted her roommate, and her roommate confessed, and set up a repayment plan to pay for the porn. My friend also demanded that her roommate go talk to the bishop as well. This seems a little strong, but you know how women are.

    Also, you should know that this returned missionary roommate was a sweet spirit. She was very homely looking and quite overweight. (Although she had a really sparkling personality and was a ton of fun.) This will figure into the end of this story.

    gotta go for a bit. be back.
    Along this same lines it may be good to mention the growing popularity of 'mommy porn' so the priesthood knows how to deal with that problem as well. Like knowing which hardware stores carry cotton rope, for example.
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  7. #397
    Members Only Dwight Schr-ute's Avatar
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    Default I taught in church today

    Here are some comments I had in the "Learned at Church" thread awhile back: Speaking of lessons on pornography, it only took 10 minutes or so before someone reference "porn addiction is one of the biggest challenges in the Church today." Against my better judgement, I raised my hand and challenged the idea. "Is porn addiction the church's biggest challenge or is the church addicted to porn addiction?" I argued that we throw the term "addiction" around irresponsibly. Someone who sneaks a little porn in a couple times a month is no more a porn addict than someone who drinks a few beers a couple times a month is an alcoholic. All the branding does is motivate people to drive the behavior underground. Treating it like a disease causes wives to be unforgiving, insecure and in many occasions, provides them the justification to leave otherwise, perfectly loving and able husbands. We've become Don Quiote's chasing giants that are nothing more than windmills. Pornography outside the church doesn't seem to be nearly as destructive to families as it is inside the church. Pornography in the church probably isn't as big of a problem as the way we talk about pornography in the church is.

    That was the end of my comments then, but I'm going to ramble on for a bit.
    As a biologist, I think we do a disservice when we focus so much on pornography and completely ignore sexuality. Reproduction is one of the biggest drives/impulses in most living things. The more the church focuses on modesty and snuffing out porn, the weirder the sexual outlets become: i.e. see the wife blog who's husband gets his fix off Google maps, iTunes etc. I'd be curious to see what the rate of "porn addiction" is within the church vs. outside the church vs. Europe where sexuality seems to be much less obsessed about.

    Women seem to enjoy focusing on porn because it alleviates them of any responsibility. How different would the conversation be if the focus was on healthy sexual relationships? This is especially important as parents and how we talk to our children about their developing bodies. We can't effectively just tell a 14 boy to don't look at porn, don't play with your penis without trying to help them understand why they're probably constantly thinking about it.

    I've taught this lesson a bunch of times. When I do, I like to start with the story of King David from 2 Samuel 11. But instead of putting the focus on Bath-sheba, and the pregnancy and the killing of Uriah, I like to put the focus on a line from the first verse: "But David tarried still in Jerusalem." David wasn't where he should have been.
    Last edited by Dwight Schr-ute; 09-09-2014 at 11:41 AM.

  8. #398
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Here are some comments I had in the "Learned at Church" thread awhile back: Speaking of lessons on pornography, it only took 10 minutes or so before someone reference "porn addiction is one of the biggest challenges in the Church today." Against my better judgement, I raised my hand and challenged the idea. "Is porn addiction the church's biggest challenge or is the church addicted to porn addiction?" I argued that we throw the term "addiction" around irresponsibly. Someone who sneaks a little porn in a couple times a month is no more a porn addict than someone who drinks a few beers a couple times a month is an alcoholic. All the branding does is motivate people to drive the behavior underground. Treating it like a disease causes wives to be unforgiving, insecure and in many occasions, provides them the justification to leave otherwise, perfectly loving and able husbands. We've become Don Quiote's chasing giants that are nothing more than windmills. Pornography outside the church doesn't seem to be nearly as destructive to families as it is inside the church. Pornography in the church probably isn't as big of a problem as the way we talk about pornography in the church is.

    That was the end of my comments then, but I'm going to ramble on for a bit.
    As a biologist, I think we do a disservice when we focus so much on pornography and completely ignore sexuality. Reproduction is one of the biggest drives/impulses in most living things. The more the church focuses on modesty and snuffing out porn, the weirder the sexual outlets become: i.e. see the wife blog who's husband gets his fix off Google maps, iTunes etc. I'd be curious to see what the rate of "porn addiction" is within the church vs. outside the church vs. Europe where sexuality seems to be much less obsessed about.

    Women seem to enjoy focusing on porn because it alleviates them of any responsibility. How different would the conversation be if the focus was on healthy sexual relationships? This is especially important as parents and how we talk to our children about their developing bodies. We can't effectively just tell a 14 boy to don't look at porn, don't play with your penis without trying to help them understand why they're probably constantly thinking about it.

    I've taught this lesson a bunch of times. When I do, I like to start with the story of King David from 2 Samuel 11. But instead of putting the focus on Bath-sheba, and the pregnancy and the killing of Uriah, I like to put the focus on a line from the first verse: "But David tarried still in Jerusalem." David wasn't where he should have been.
    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

  9. #399

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Here are some comments I had in the "Learned at Church" thread awhile back: Speaking of lessons on pornography, it only took 10 minutes or so before someone reference "porn addiction is one of the biggest challenges in the Church today." Against my better judgement, I raised my hand and challenged the idea. "Is porn addiction the church's biggest challenge or is the church addicted to porn addiction?" I argued that we throw the term "addiction" around irresponsibly. Someone who sneaks a little porn in a couple times a month is no more a porn addict than someone who drinks a few beers a couple times a month is an alcoholic. All the branding does is motivate people to drive the behavior underground. Treating it like a disease causes wives to be unforgiving, insecure and in many occasions, provides them the justification to leave otherwise, perfectly loving and able husbands. We've become Don Quiote's chasing giants that are nothing more than windmills. Pornography outside the church doesn't seem to be nearly as destructive to families as it is inside the church. Pornography in the church probably isn't as big of a problem as the way we talk about pornography in the church is.

    That was the end of my comments then, but I'm going to ramble on for a bit.
    As a biologist, I think we do a disservice when we focus so much on pornography and completely ignore sexuality. Reproduction is one of the biggest drives/impulses in most living things. The more the church focuses on modesty and snuffing out porn, the weirder the sexual outlets become: i.e. see the wife blog who's husband gets his fix off Google maps, iTunes etc. I'd be curious to see what the rate of "porn addiction" is within the church vs. outside the church vs. Europe where sexuality seems to be much less obsessed about.

    Women seem to enjoy focusing on porn because it alleviates them of any responsibility. How different would the conversation be if the focus was on healthy sexual relationships? This is especially important as parents and how we talk to our children about their developing bodies. We can't effectively just tell a 14 boy to don't look at porn, don't play with your penis without trying to help them understand why they're probably constantly thinking about it.

    I've taught this lesson a bunch of times. When I do, I like to start with the story of King David from 2 Samuel 11. But instead of putting the focus on Bath-sheba, and the pregnancy and the killing of Uriah, I like to put the focus on a line from the first verse: "But David tarried still in Jerusalem." David wasn't where he should have been.
    Good stuff, DS.

  10. #400
    Stepping Razor wuapinmon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by byu71 View Post
    No, but I think a man in his 60's would.
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  11. #401
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwight Schr-ute View Post
    Here are some comments I had in the "Learned at Church" thread awhile back: Speaking of lessons on pornography, it only took 10 minutes or so before someone reference "porn addiction is one of the biggest challenges in the Church today." Against my better judgement, I raised my hand and challenged the idea. "Is porn addiction the church's biggest challenge or is the church addicted to porn addiction?" I argued that we throw the term "addiction" around irresponsibly. Someone who sneaks a little porn in a couple times a month is no more a porn addict than someone who drinks a few beers a couple times a month is an alcoholic. All the branding does is motivate people to drive the behavior underground. Treating it like a disease causes wives to be unforgiving, insecure and in many occasions, provides them the justification to leave otherwise, perfectly loving and able husbands. We've become Don Quiote's chasing giants that are nothing more than windmills. Pornography outside the church doesn't seem to be nearly as destructive to families as it is inside the church. Pornography in the church probably isn't as big of a problem as the way we talk about pornography in the church is.

    That was the end of my comments then, but I'm going to ramble on for a bit.
    As a biologist, I think we do a disservice when we focus so much on pornography and completely ignore sexuality. Reproduction is one of the biggest drives/impulses in most living things. The more the church focuses on modesty and snuffing out porn, the weirder the sexual outlets become: i.e. see the wife blog who's husband gets his fix off Google maps, iTunes etc. I'd be curious to see what the rate of "porn addiction" is within the church vs. outside the church vs. Europe where sexuality seems to be much less obsessed about.

    Women seem to enjoy focusing on porn because it alleviates them of any responsibility. How different would the conversation be if the focus was on healthy sexual relationships? This is especially important as parents and how we talk to our children about their developing bodies. We can't effectively just tell a 14 boy to don't look at porn, don't play with your penis without trying to help them understand why they're probably constantly thinking about it.

    I've taught this lesson a bunch of times. When I do, I like to start with the story of King David from 2 Samuel 11. But instead of putting the focus on Bath-sheba, and the pregnancy and the killing of Uriah, I like to put the focus on a line from the first verse: "But David tarried still in Jerusalem." David wasn't where he should have been.

    Good stuff.

    This video might be useful for parents talking to children about their developing bodies, BTW:

    "If there is one thing I am, it's always right." -Ted Nugent.
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  12. #402

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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Anyway, the roommate gets back from her confession with the bishop. (I heard this from my friend, not the porn consuming roommate, so I don't know what her state of mind was.) She got no discipline. Nothing. Not even a suggestion to stop taking the sacrament.

    When she confessed, she broke down and cried and said that because she was so unattractive, she had no hopes of getting married, so she would never know what a physical relationship between a man and a woman would be like, and porn movies were the only way she could satisfy her curiosity. It was the closest she would ever get to having sex with a real husband. And why couldn't she have a husband? It was promised in her patriarchal blessing that she would be married with many, many children, but no priesthood holder wanted to date her. She was a worthy temple rec holder, why can't she get eternal temple blessings from marriage?

    That was it. Nothing was said about how she probably wasn't a recommend holder at that moment. Nothing about how if she were curious, why didn't she just watch one movie? Why 3 movies a night for 3 months? No counseling about how porn does not depict a loving relationship between two worthy people striving for exaltation. No details demanded of her about exactly what type of porn she was watching. Just "Dont do it again."

    Would an RM man in his middle 20s get the same treatment?
    Maybe the RM's need to try that tack. Body image issues, no hope to get married, etc. Then perhaps they'll get the same slap on the wrist.

  13. #403
    Bald not naked Pelado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Ted View Post
    Good stuff.

    This video might be useful for parents talking to children about their developing bodies, BTW:

    That's awesome. Damn nocturnal emissions.
    "I think it was King Benjamin who said 'you sorry ass shitbags who have no skills that the market values also have an obligation to have the attitude that if one day you do in fact win the PowerBall Lottery that you will then impart of your substance to those without.'"
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  14. #404
    Senior Member Katy Lied's Avatar
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    Tomorrow in GD 39 we get to discuss Pheidippides at length. Along with a discussion on feet. As in "do you think your feet are beautiful? What would make Isaiah say you have beautiful feet?" It shall be fun.

    This is one of the most beautiful lessons to teach--of all 4 years. The Isaiah account of the Atonement and Redemption is absolutely precious. Even those who see the Bible as just allegory must see this as a gorgeous doctrine of belief. For those with faith, it is unimaginably moving.
    Last edited by Katy Lied; 11-01-2014 at 10:41 PM.

  15. #405

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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Tomorrow in GD we get to discuss Pheidippides at length. Along with a discussion on feet. As in "do you think your feet are beautiful? What would make Isaiah say you have beautiful feet?" It shall be fun.
    I hope you aren't using a shirtless pic to introduce him.

  16. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Tomorrow in GD 39 we get to discuss Pheidippides at length. Along with a discussion on feet. As in "do you think your feet are beautiful? What would make Isaiah say you have beautiful feet?" It shall be fun.

    This is one of the most beautiful lessons to teach--of all 4 years. The Isaiah account of the Atonement and Redemption is absolutely precious. Even those who see the Bible as just allegory must see this as a gorgeous doctrine of belief. For those with faith, it is unimaginably moving.
    Aren't "feet" generally used as a euphemism for genitals in the OT? Maybe you could explore that angle of the verse
    "Discipleship is not a spectator sport. We cannot expect to experience the blessing of faith by standing inactive on the sidelines any more than we can experience the benefits of health by sitting on a sofa watching sporting events on television and giving advice to the athletes. And yet for some, “spectator discipleship” is a preferred if not primary way of worshipping." -Pres. Uchtdorf

  17. #407
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    Hopefully Hawaiians or other people who grew up wearing sandals are not offended by this lesson!
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  18. #408
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripletDaddy View Post
    Hopefully Hawaiians or other people who grew up wearing sandals are not offended by this lesson!
    What about marsupial?
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  19. #409
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuskyFreeNorthwest View Post
    What about marsupial?
    I doubt she will even go to the lesson.
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  20. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripletDaddy View Post
    I doubt she will even go to the lesson.
    I sure hope the HG didn't whisper softly to her this week and she had a softening of her heart and a desire to attend.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuskyFreeNorthwest View Post
    I sure hope the HG didn't whisper softly to her this week and she had a softening of her heart and a desire to attend.
    If she were to attend, she really should be going to Gospel Essentials for the basics, not Katy Lied's advanced Gospel Doctrine lesson about whether people like their own feet.
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  22. #412
    Drunkard of Ephraim Solon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katy Lied View Post
    Tomorrow in GD 39 we get to discuss Pheidippides at length. Along with a discussion on feet. As in "do you think your feet are beautiful? What would make Isaiah say you have beautiful feet?" It shall be fun.

    This is one of the most beautiful lessons to teach--of all 4 years. The Isaiah account of the Atonement and Redemption is absolutely precious. Even those who see the Bible as just allegory must see this as a gorgeous doctrine of belief. For those with faith, it is unimaginably moving.
    KL - does it make a difference to you (in terms of the import & impact of these sections) that these are "2nd Isaiah" chapters, most likely written during the Exile?

    It actually makes the verses more poignant to me as I feel Israel's longing & yearning for home.
    I think you could make some hay from this as a metaphor for the longing & yearning for redemption / reconciliation.

    Personally, I especially like 49.4-5, that promises that things will be okay "though Israel be not gathered [yet]".

    Also, I use chapter 45 in history classes sometimes when we're discussing Cyrus. I think 45.22 is an allusion to Ancient Near Eastern claims of sovereignty over all the ends of the earth, and Jehovah's language seems to be echoing these types of boasts or vaunts typical of ANE documents (see, e.g., the Cyrus Cylinder, where Cyrus boasts that he is "king of the universe, the great king, the powerful king, king of Babylon, king of Sumer and Akkad, king of the four quarters of the world" http://www.britishmuseum.org/explore...anslation.aspx )
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  23. #413
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    I wish Solon was my Sunday School teacher.
    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solon View Post
    KL - does it make a difference to you (in terms of the import & impact of these sections) that these are "2nd Isaiah" chapters, most likely written during the Exile?

    It actually makes the verses more poignant to me as I feel Israel's longing & yearning for home.
    I think you could make some hay from this as a metaphor for the longing & yearning for redemption / reconciliation.

    Personally, I especially like 49.4-5, that promises that things will be okay "though Israel be not gathered [yet]".

    Also, I use chapter 45 in history classes sometimes when we're discussing Cyrus. I think 45.22 is an allusion to Ancient Near Eastern claims of sovereignty over all the ends of the earth, and Jehovah's language seems to be echoing these types of boasts or vaunts typical of ANE documents (see, e.g., the Cyrus Cylinder, where Cyrus boasts that he is "king of the universe, the great king, the powerful king, king of Babylon, king of Sumer and Akkad, king of the four quarters of the world" http://www.britishmuseum.org/explore...anslation.aspx )
    I taught this lesson a couple of weeks ago and raised the idea of second Isaiah. It was, oddly, a fairly controversial thing. Some of the more orthodox who were paying attention seemed very annoyed at the idea, most people seemed confused (which probably speaks more to my abilities than anything), and others, as usual, just wanted the lesson to END. I love yearning that is evident in some of the verses. And, to be honest, I find it very easy to believe there are at least two authors for the book given the complete change in tone/style etc.
    PLesa excuse the tpyos.

  25. #415
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    I wish Solon was my Sunday School teacher.

    "More crazy people to Provo go than to any other town in the state."
    -- Iron County Record. 23 August, 1912. (http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lc...23/ed-1/seq-4/)

  26. #416

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    I wish Solon was my Sunday School teacher.
    He's been mine and it was glorious
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  27. #417

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    Fortunately, the impressionable adult minds in Solon's ward are kept safe from the "wisdom" of Solon and his PhD wife.
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  28. #418
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    My 12yo son taught his SS class today on assignment from his SS teacher. Before Church, we went over the lesson together. Science gets a shout out here:

    Show the children the pencil and explain that the writing portion of the pencil is graphite, which is a form of carbon. Ask the children to estimate the value of the graphite in the pencil. Then show the diamond (or describe one) and explain that scientists believe diamonds were formed millions of years ago when carbon was subjected to great heat and pressure.
    Those scientists and their crazy "beliefs"!!

  29. #419
    Pre-Historic Man
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Allendale County, SC
    Posts
    5,012

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    I would go to Solon's lessons.
    黑猫, 白猫, 只要会抓老鼠的就是哦好猫

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