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Thread: Bigfoot: I want to believe

  1. #241
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    You're a moving target. You're using the absence of fossil Bigfoot as an argument for their nonexistence. I brought up the lack of fossil evidence of a well-known primate to demonstrate why the lack of fossil evidence does not support your position. I know chimps have been seen, captured and studied - that's the point of the analogy. There are good reasons for the lack of fossil evidence of chimps, which potentially also apply to the lack of Bigfoot fossils. Had I pointed to the lack of fossil evidence of unicorns, it wouldn't have supported my argument, would it?
    I think you are confusing me with creekster. I think the lack of bones and carcasses is FAR more compelling.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    I focused on fossils because you brought it up. "If you go into the forest you will find animal bones everywhere." What forests do you go into? I saw a video once showing a deer carcass decomposing in about a week. If you happen to come upon a recently-killed animal, you may find some bones. But how often have you come across the remains of an apex predator, such as a mountain lion or a bear? For what would be an apex predator which is far rarer than mountain lions or bears, it's not surprising that there aren't a lot of bones around. If you also consider that Bigfoot reportedly live primarily in the more remote parts of the forest, it's really not that surprising people aren't stumbling on bigfoot bones.
    Apex predator bones are less prevalent than deer, etc. but they exist in great abundance. I have seen several. Still waiting to see a single Bigfoot skeleton.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    By pointing out that chimps are seen, you're implying that Bigfoot aren't. Which is true if you discount the thousands of witness reports, as you have in your last sentence. They are either hoaxes or imagined. There are some questions raised by that, however. Why aren't there thousands of reported sightings of unicorns? Or mermaids? Or fairies? Why the disproportionate number of bigfoot sightings?
    More popular myth I suppose. Again, alien and ghost encounters are pretty common too.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    Also, BFRO has maps of their recorded witness encounters. They're not random. They are most frequent in areas of thick or remote forest. Keep in mind, there are a lot of roadside encounters - but primarily in heavily-forested areas. Are there more delusional people near forests?
    People expect to see them near forests and so they imagine they see them. They wouldn't expect to see them near the desert.


    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    If you take the time to actually read some of the witness statements, you find that many of them come across as regular people who never believed in bigfoot before (of course, I'm sure you'd point out that they could be bigfoot believers in disguise).

    Yeah, there are crazies who believe in bigfoot. But there are also quite a few intelligent, successful, sane people who do as well. Not people who seem to be prone to imagining seeing big, hairy monsters in the woods.

    If you really want to see a scientific approach to bigfoot, look up Dr. Jeff Meldrum's studies on bigfoot footprints. He's an expert in foot morphology and locomotion in primates, and he's published articles and papers on why he believes some of the alleged bigfoot footprints cannot be faked.
    Meldrum is a kook.
    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

  2. #242

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    I bet Lebowski didn't believe in the Kraken, either. Until today!


  3. #243
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Indy Coug View Post
    I thought they admitted this was a hoax?
    Nope. You may be confusing this with the guy who admitted that the famous Loch Ness Monster photo was a hoax.
    If we disagree on something, it's because you're wrong.

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  4. #244

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    No blurry photos or shaky video of Daisy yet?

  5. #245
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    I think you are confusing me with creekster. I think the lack of bones and carcasses is FAR more compelling.
    You're right. I'm mixing up my primates.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Apex predator bones are less prevalent than deer, etc. but they exist in great abundance. I have seen several. Still waiting to see a single Bigfoot skeleton.
    Wait a couple weeks. I also would question where you're looking. Plus, with Bigfoot allegedly being a bipedal hominid, and (at least according to Dr. Ketchum) possibly a human/relic human hybrid, that would come with increase intelligence (above that of any other apex predator). There are reports that bigfoot live primarily in family pods, and that they bury their dead. While I'm sure that's a little far out there to convince you, there is precedent in the known natural world, in that elephants are known to have a death ritual, in which they treat their dead with special care. They have been observed to guard the body of a dead herd member, and to cover a dead elephant with branches and dirt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    More popular myth I suppose. Again, alien and ghost encounters are pretty common too.

    People expect to see them near forests and so they imagine they see them. They wouldn't expect to see them near the desert.
    There are plenty of wooded areas where there are few or no reports of bigfoot. If it's pure myth and imagination, you wouldn't expect to see any real pattern in the sightings, but you do.[/QUOTE]


    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Meldrum is a kook.
    I'm curious - is this based on any observation or knowledge of him independent of his involvement in Bigfoot research?
    If we disagree on something, it's because you're wrong.

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  6. #246
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    An interesting point here: Has a previously-unknown, human-sized primate been discovered and first scientifically proven within the last 20 years?

    Answer: Yes. The Bili Ape, which looks primarily like a 6-foot tall (when standing upright) chimp, but has some gorilla characteristics, as well, was discovered (at least a skull was) by a Swiss photographer in 1996. They were first located and studied by scientists in 2005-2006, in the Congo. Prior to that, there was local legend and some physical evidence (which many would probably have found unpersuasive, anyway).
    If we disagree on something, it's because you're wrong.

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    I'd also like to point out that fossils of ManBearPig have never been found, yet we all know he exists.

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  8. #248
    It is NOT a monkey! creekster's Avatar
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    Hey! Be fair to my posts!

    I don't have time to go in to detail but I want to point out that I also mentioned the lack of carcasses etc. that is highly compelling from my POV. Fact is we have neither fossils nor bones nor carcasses etc. nothing that is reliable or undisputed.

    Most simply stateD, I think Bigfoot is a manifestation of our collective fear of the dark. Seriously. We are all afraid of the monster beyond the fire light or in the close etc. it is a powerful psychological urge.

    Otherwise I think most of the Bigfoot crowd tries to apologize for lack of evidence but never actually produces it. A captured Bigfoot? Please.
    PLesa excuse the tpyos.

  9. #249
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    Wait a couple weeks. I also would question where you're looking. Plus, with Bigfoot allegedly being a bipedal hominid, and (at least according to Dr. Ketchum) possibly a human/relic human hybrid, that would come with increase intelligence (above that of any other apex predator). There are reports that bigfoot live primarily in family pods, and that they bury their dead. While I'm sure that's a little far out there to convince you, there is precedent in the known natural world, in that elephants are known to have a death ritual, in which they treat their dead with special care. They have been observed to guard the body of a dead herd member, and to cover a dead elephant with branches and dirt.
    LOL. They bury their dead. Of course.

    I will reiterate my earlier offer: bet me $100 that we won't have a confirmed captured Bigfoot (live or dead) in two weeks. I will even give you 2:1 odds if you like.
    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

  10. #250
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    There are plenty of wooded areas where there are few or no reports of bigfoot. If it's pure myth and imagination, you wouldn't expect to see any real pattern in the sightings, but you do.
    So how did Bigfoot get to Australia? That is the most unique and biologically isolated place on the planet. Yet somehow the folks down under are reportedly seeing Bigfoot everywhere. Hmmm....
    Last edited by Jeff Lebowski; 01-08-2013 at 10:17 AM.
    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

  11. #251
    It is NOT a monkey! creekster's Avatar
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    What population size would be required to sustain this animal as a viable species over an area as vast as, say, the Sierra Nevada or the Himalayas or the Coastal range? That's a helluva lot of apes.
    PLesa excuse the tpyos.

  12. #252
    Senior Member SteelBlue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by creekster View Post
    Most simply stateD, I think Bigfoot is a manifestation of our collective fear of the dark. Seriously. We are all afraid of the monster beyond the fire light or in the close etc. it is a powerful psychological urge.
    I think this is the most reasonable explanation for sightings and searchings. It also explains why nearly every culture and continent have bigfoot legends.

    As a sidenote, it's interesting how much SoCal's arguments remind me of the days when I used to read FARMS.

  13. #253
    Liberal Feminazi Pheidippides's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelBlue View Post

    As a sidenote, it's interesting how much SoCal's arguments remind me of the days when I used to read FARMS.
    Point taken for a low blow. Keep the gloves above the belt.
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  14. #254
    Where's Wallace? Surfah's Avatar
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    This is one of my favorite threads. Keep up the good fight SoCalCoug.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfah View Post
    This is one of my favorite threads. Keep up the good fight SoCalCoug.
    Seriously. SoCal is killing it.

  16. #256
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smokymountainrain View Post
    Seriously. SoCal is killing it.
    Thirded. I love this thread.

  17. #257
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelBlue View Post
    As a sidenote, it's interesting how much SoCal's arguments remind me of the days when I used to read FARMS.
    Oh, no you di'n't!
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  18. #258
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    So how did Bigfoot get to Australia? That is the most unique and biologically isolated place on the planet. Yet somehow the folks down under are reportedly seeing Bigfoot everywhere. Hmmm....
    Oh, no, you're not going to take me there. Let's worry about the North American bigfoot before we get into the other three species.
    If we disagree on something, it's because you're wrong.

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  19. #259
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    Oh, no, you're not going to take me there. Let's worry about the North American bigfoot before we get into the other three species.


    We haven't found a single specimen, but we have identified multiple species?

    So that's what you call me. You know, that or, uh, His Dudeness, or uh, Duder, or El Duderino if you're not into the whole brevity thing.

  20. #260

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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    Oh, no, you're not going to take me there. Let's worry about the North American bigfoot before we get into the other three species.
    I saw that episode. The Australian version is called a Yowie. Apparently a little shorter and much more aggressive than its North American counterpart. I really thought they were going to find one on that episode.

  21. #261
    Local Character clackamascoug's Avatar
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    I think the Bigfoot show is doing more harm than good. I'm sure the people on the show are good folk in a individual sense, but as a collective they are less than credible. Keystoneish.

    I do wish to learn more about Daisy. Her hopes and dreams, and whether she found captivity to be exhilarating, compared to her day to day life. I hope her captors are treating her well.

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  22. #262

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    Quote Originally Posted by clackamascoug View Post
    I think the Bigfoot show is doing more harm than good. I'm sure the people on the show are good folk in a individual sense, but as a collective they are less than credible. Keystoneish.

    I do wish to learn more about Daisy. Her hopes and dreams, and whether she found captivity to be exhilarating, compared to her day to day life. I hope her captors are treating her well.
    My favorite part of the show is when they do the howls in the middle of the night and wait for the response. They always hear something, and the androgynous chick always says it could be owls or coyotes and Bobo always says it's definitely a Squatch. Fair and balanced.

    I don't know if Bigfoot is real, but I like the show and I definitely want to get one of those cool thermal, night vision rigs.
    Last edited by Non Sequitur; 01-08-2013 at 02:19 PM.

  23. #263

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
    Thirded. I love this thread.
    This thread dominates. For me (an admittedly undevoted student of SoCal's posts), half of the fun is figuring out how much/if any of this thread is trolling.

  24. #264
    Senior Member SteelBlue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Non Sequitur View Post
    My favorite part of the show is when they do the howls in the middle of the night and wait for the response. They always hear something, and the androgynous chick always says it could be owls or coyotes and Bobo always says it's definitely a Squatch. Fair and balanced.

    I don't know if Bigfoot is real, but I like the show and I definitely want to get one of those cool thermal, night vision rigs.
    I love the term "squatchy" that I've learned from that show. Everything and everywhere is squatchy to Bobo.

  25. #265
    I like to dance! SoCalCoug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteelBlue View Post
    I love the term "squatchy" that I've learned from that show. Everything and everywhere is squatchy to Bobo.
    Honestly, I don't watch the show much at all. But what I've noticed from the bits I've seen, compared to video of Bobo in other scenarios, to me, he comes across far more knowledgeable and credible than he does in the show itself.

    Take Moneymaker at his name. He's milking this show for all he can. The on-camera personalities are not reality. They're not going to find bigfoot (even assuming bigfoot is real).

    Although Moneymaker is generally respected for what he's done with BFRO, which is the leading site in the bigfoot community, he is not well-liked or well-regarded as a person, by those who have had dealings with him.

    Bobo, on the other hand, is almost universally liked and respected within the bigfoot community.
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  26. #266
    Senior Member Portland Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post


    We haven't found a single specimen, but we have identified multiple species?

    Look, you saw the Australian Bigfoot Hunter episode.

    You know that the Four Horsemen of the Sasquatcholipse confirmed the squatchiness of Australia's Gold Coast and the presence of Yowies there.

    You also know that Bobo initially thought Yowies were very different but after being in Australie realized they look and act just like Bigfoots (aside from being a bit more aggressive)!

    If that's not compelling, I don't know what is.
    Last edited by Portland Ute; 01-08-2013 at 06:02 PM.

  27. #267
    Senior Member Portland Ute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalCoug View Post
    They're not going to find bigfoot.
    Agreed.

    Although Moneymaker is generally respected for what he's done with BFRO, which is the leading site in the bigfoot community, he is not well-liked or well-regarded as a person, by those who have had dealings with him.

    Bobo, on the other hand, is almost universally liked and respected within the bigfoot community.
    Is Moneymaker a lush? He comes across as a hot-headed, arrogant drunk on the show. I swear he's hung over half that time.

    Bobo is a loveable idiot. He's a moron, but he is hard to hate because he is so simple, vulnerable and personable.

    I wonder if they gave the entire crew, sans the woman, lessons in "jazz hands." I swear Money maker and that Cliff guy talk so much with their hands that you wonder if they aren't Latin women....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Portland Ute View Post
    Bobo is a loveable idiot. He's a moron, but he is hard to hate because he is so simple, vulnerable and personable.
    Bobo is a great guy, but you wouldn't want to let him pet your rabbit.

  29. #269
    The Dude Jeff Lebowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Non Sequitur View Post
    Bobo is a great guy, but you wouldn't want to let him pet your rabbit.
    Ok, that was funny.

  30. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by Non Sequitur View Post
    I saw that episode. The Australian version is called a Yowie. Apparently a little shorter and much more aggressive than its North American counterpart. I really thought they were going to find one on that episode.


    I thought he was called Taz.
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