HBO's Game of Thrones

[Surfah]

Spoiler for GoT Spoiler:

Not sure how I feel about things. Now that the initial shock has subsided I am left WTF. 8 years of buildup for that? We have zero effing clue what Brand was doing and what the motivations for the NK were. I'm getting pissed the more I think about it.

[old_gregg]

Spoiler for GoT Spoiler:

Not sure how I feel about things. Now that the initial shock has subsided I am left WTF. 8 years of buildup for that? We have zero effing clue what Brand was doing and what the motivations for the NK were. I'm getting pissed the more I think about it.

Spoiler for durrrrr:

totally agree. we've had eight seasons of build up re magic, lore, important cultural/historical narratives, etc., and the only nk motivation we've ever heard is that he wants to erase the world? so stupid. why dick around with all of the children of the forest bullshit earlier on, including creation of the night king? plus, everyone apparently has impenetrable plot armor now. dumb.

[PaloAltoCougar]

Too much battle; not enough plot exposition. Looking forward to next week's roll call, though.

[Commando]

Spoiler for GoT Spoiler:

Not sure how I feel about things. Now that the initial shock has subsided I am left WTF. 8 years of buildup for that? We have zero effing clue what Brand was doing and what the motivations for the NK were. I'm getting pissed the more I think about it.

Remember the episode where Bran sees the creation of the NK? Your answers are in that episode.

[frank ryan]

Remember the episode where Bran sees the creation of the NK? Your answers are in that episode.

I'll leave this here:

https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/29/1...elisandre-arya

[Color Me Badd Fan]

The battle episodes are not necessarily my favorite episodes of the series. It's not that they're poorly executed, it's just there are other standout episodes that overshadow them -- Cersei blowing up the cathedral, Tyrion's trial, Hodor "holding the door," etc. The loot train battle episode was spectacular, but that was probably only around 15 minutes.

That said, the high water mark was set with the first battle episode -- Blackwater. There was some strategy, ingenuity combined with desperation. Sometimes pure desperation is called for when the enemy is an unknown -- e.g. Hardhome. But this was an episode where it seems like the protagonists could have employed some strategy. Let's lure the Night King over to Bran (great!), then let's guard him with 10 normal dudes and Theon?

Why aren't they having the five people with Valyrian swords/blades hanging out in the general vicinity of Bran? Or if they're more valuable leading the troops (Jamie) or flying around on a dragon (Jon), then they give their swords to someone else. Give longclaw to the Hound, Jamie's sword could go to Tormund -- or on second thought, how great would it have been if Jamie, of all people, is there defending Bran and not out leading the soldiers? They did something similar with Theon I suppose.

I thought it was great that Arya killed the Night King, the manner kind of sucked. Have some fights with the other actual White Walkers, Arya could have dress up as Bran with the real Bran concealed somehow very close by. It seems like they dicked around in the first two episodes and the protagonists gave little thought on how to outsmart the NK.

[wuapinmon]

Not a fan of the episode. The Night King has a mouth, but never speaks. The other walkers never fight? I get the fog of war/darkness metaphor, but that was some shit cinemaphotography. What was the point of Bran worging into the ravens? What was he doing the whole time? What's the point of having a Three-Eyed Raven? Our knowledge? Our memory? WTF is the Citadel for then?

If this were any more of a let-down I'd almost think that Damon Lindelhof and Carlton Cuse wrote it.

[PaloAltoCougar]

A few thoughts about last night [sorry if some of this has spoilers, but if you haven't seen the episode, why are you reading this thread at this late date?].

I agree with wuap, it wasn't a great episode, despite the big budget.

As has often been the case, the filming was too dark, presumably because special effects are easier/cheaper to do if the details are obscured. Still, it bugs me.

I was surprised how many of the key characters actually survived. Not sure how Greyworm, Brienne, Sam, and a couple of others managed to get through it, but I like all of them so… not complaining.

Some really lousy battle planning by the council. Why did they keep the dragons out of the fray until after the Dothraki had outridden their fireball artillery fire? Why charge so soon? Or at all?

I would have preferred to have Jaime alongside Theon guarding Bran. Theon completed a satisfying redemptive arc; there’s almost certainly more to come for Jaime.

My favorite scene may have been Melisandre and Arya. Mel agrees with Arya’s comment about her prediction that Arya would kill a lot of people—the original prophecy mentioned “brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes…” But last night Mel said “Brown eyes, green eyes,” and after an extra pause, said with a little emphasis, “… blue eyes,” as Arya considers very carefully what/how she was saying it. Then, with the Wights screaming and clawing at the door, Mel asks calmly, “What to we say to the God of Death?” Arya responds with firm resolve, “Not today.” Arya then turns slowly, walks, then runs, out to meet the blue-eyed King of the Night.

So what’s next? It’s great the Night King and ice zombies are done (at least I hope), as I believe they were only a secondary plot to the main theme: the intra-and inter-family struggles, which can now get full attention. It’ll be interesting to see if Jaime fulfills prophecy by being the one who kills Cersei, or if Arya will get to cross that one off her list by herself. I also expect Tyrion to provide to keen insights how to bring down Kings Landing and House Lannister, restoring Dany’s opinion of his counsel. And after last night, I’m kind of hoping Sansa and Tyrion marry a second time. Why else would Tryion have sworn off whoring?

It’s a little embarrassing that in six weeks I’ve gone from total GoT ignorance to Seven Kingdoms dork.

[Color Me Badd Fan]

A few thoughts about last night [sorry if some of this has spoilers, but if you haven't seen the episode, why are you reading this thread at this late date?].

I agree with wuap, it wasn't a great episode, despite the big budget.

As has often been the case, the filming was too dark, presumably because special effects are easier/cheaper to do if the details are obscured. Still, it bugs me.

I was surprised how many of the key characters actually survived. Not sure how Greyworm, Brienne, Sam, and a couple of others managed to get through it, but I like all of them so… not complaining.

Some really lousy battle planning by the council. Why did they keep the dragons out of the fray until after the Dothraki had outridden their fireball artillery fire? Why charge so soon? Or at all?

I would have preferred to have Jaime alongside Theon guarding Bran. Theon completed a satisfying redemptive arc; there’s almost certainly more to come for Jaime.

My favorite scene may have been Melisandre and Arya. Mel agrees with Arya’s comment about her prediction that Arya would kill a lot of people—the original prophecy mentioned “brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes…” But last night Mel said “Brown eyes, green eyes,” and after an extra pause, said with a little emphasis, “… blue eyes,” as Arya considers very carefully what/how she was saying it. Then, with the Wights screaming and clawing at the door, Mel asks calmly, “What to we say to the God of Death?” Arya responds with firm resolve, “Not today.” Arya then turns slowly, walks, then runs, out to meet the blue-eyed King of the Night.

So what’s next? It’s great the Night King and ice zombies are done (at least I hope), as I believe they were only a secondary plot to the main theme: the intra-and inter-family struggles, which can now get full attention. It’ll be interesting to see if Jaime fulfills prophecy by being the one who kills Cersei, or if Arya will get to cross that one off her list by herself. I also expect Tyrion to provide to keen insights how to bring down Kings Landing and House Lannister, restoring Dany’s opinion of his counsel. And after last night, I’m kind of hoping Sansa and Tyrion marry a second time. Why else would Tryion have sworn off whoring?

It’s a little embarrassing that in six weeks I’ve gone from total GoT ignorance to Seven Kingdoms dork.

Since Arya killed the Night King, I'll be surprised if she's the one that kills Cersei. I feel like the character who has suffered the most at the hands of Cersei, other than possibly Tyrion, is Sansa. I don't know how they would maneuver things so Sansa would be the one to do the deed. There are obviously a lot of people who feel Jaime is going to be the one who does it.

Someone pointed out two of the leaders of the houses involved with the Red Wedding have died in similar fashion as two of the three notable characters who were killed at the Red Wedding. Lord Frey had his throat slit like Catelyn Stark, Roose Bolton was stabbed between the ribs (or in that general area) like Robb Stark -- the only one left is the leader of House Lannister and Oona Chaplin was pregnant and stabbed in the stomach repeatedly. Is Jaime going to be one that does something like that?

Arya would do this. Sansa would too if given the opportunity. Doesn't seem like Jon would do this. Tyrion, I don't know. Daenerys, yes.

[ERCougar]

A few thoughts about last night [sorry if some of this has spoilers, but if you haven't seen the episode, why are you reading this thread at this late date?].

I agree with wuap, it wasn't a great episode, despite the big budget.

As has often been the case, the filming was too dark, presumably because special effects are easier/cheaper to do if the details are obscured. Still, it bugs me.

I was surprised how many of the key characters actually survived. Not sure how Greyworm, Brienne, Sam, and a couple of others managed to get through it, but I like all of them so… not complaining.

Some really lousy battle planning by the council. Why did they keep the dragons out of the fray until after the Dothraki had outridden their fireball artillery fire? Why charge so soon? Or at all?

I would have preferred to have Jaime alongside Theon guarding Bran. Theon completed a satisfying redemptive arc; there’s almost certainly more to come for Jaime.

My favorite scene may have been Melisandre and Arya. Mel agrees with Arya’s comment about her prediction that Arya would kill a lot of people—the original prophecy mentioned “brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes…” But last night Mel said “Brown eyes, green eyes,” and after an extra pause, said with a little emphasis, “… blue eyes,” as Arya considers very carefully what/how she was saying it. Then, with the Wights screaming and clawing at the door, Mel asks calmly, “What to we say to the God of Death?” Arya responds with firm resolve, “Not today.” Arya then turns slowly, walks, then runs, out to meet the blue-eyed King of the Night.

So what’s next? It’s great the Night King and ice zombies are done (at least I hope), as I believe they were only a secondary plot to the main theme: the intra-and inter-family struggles, which can now get full attention. It’ll be interesting to see if Jaime fulfills prophecy by being the one who kills Cersei, or if Arya will get to cross that one off her list by herself. I also expect Tyrion to provide to keen insights how to bring down Kings Landing and House Lannister, restoring Dany’s opinion of his counsel. And after last night, I’m kind of hoping Sansa and Tyrion marry a second time. Why else would Tryion have sworn off whoring?

It’s a little embarrassing that in six weeks I’ve gone from total GoT ignorance to Seven Kingdoms dork.

Can't agree more with this entire assessment. I feel like all of my friends loved this episode, and I had to look here to finally find any who weren't in love with it.

Completely agree with the lameness of the battle plan. The *only* well thought out or even halfway clever idea was the trench.

On the good side, I loved the tension build of the first 15-20 minutes. I liked the intermittent cuts to quiet. The music was effective. And I loved the Mel-Arya interaction leading to Arya's final blow. Perfect.

But the battle. Ugh. You know the NK/WW's are not going to win so as it just got more and more ridiculous, my eyes rolled as I could feel the setup for some even more ridiculous deus ex machina ending. Arya was a sort of believable out, and redeemed it a bit, but the 60 minutes of completely one sided battle was just...boring. Why not have Jon and NK have a bit of a fight, have the NK fall to the ground, and *then* raise the hordes? Or a dozen other back-and-forth options? You knew from the beginning that any tactic wasn't going to work at all.

I too am so glad we're done with zombies--the dragons are a lame enough distraction (battles really just come down to them). I'm actually much more interested in the rest of the season now, so maybe this episode wasn't a complete failure. I think the Hound kills Cersei at the end.

[frank ryan]

Can't agree more with this entire assessment. I feel like all of my friends loved this episode, and I had to look here to finally find any who weren't in love with it.

Completely agree with the lameness of the battle plan. The *only* well thought out or even halfway clever idea was the trench.

On the good side, I loved the tension build of the first 15-20 minutes. I liked the intermittent cuts to quiet. The music was effective. And I loved the Mel-Arya interaction leading to Arya's final blow. Perfect.

But the battle. Ugh. You know the NK/WW's are not going to win so as it just got more and more ridiculous, my eyes rolled as I could feel the setup for some even more ridiculous deus ex machina ending. Arya was a sort of believable out, and redeemed it a bit, but the 60 minutes of completely one sided battle was just...boring. Why not have Jon and NK have a bit of a fight, have the NK fall to the ground, and *then* raise the hordes? Or a dozen other back-and-forth options? You knew from the beginning that any tactic wasn't going to work at all.

I too am so glad we're done with zombies--the dragons are a lame enough distraction (battles really just come down to them). I'm actually much more interested in the rest of the season now, so maybe this episode wasn't a complete failure. I think the Hound kills Cersei at the end.

One of Cersei's brothers will kill her in keeping with that prophecy. I think it will be Jaime.

[Commando]

Eh. I thought it was just a lot of fun with a great payoff. Sucks to lose the Mormonts, some of the most sympathetic characters in the show, and the Dothraki would have come in handy vs. Cersei's army, but that is a fun battle and payoff. Theon came full circle in a way not many characters are allowed in a show like this. We talk about 'plot armor,' but there's a lot more show and a lot more death on the way. Would it have been satisfying to see Dany die? Not really, but it would have been exciting, and not out of step with this show's ways.

I was irritated with Jon and Dany flying around with their thumbs up their asses, though. Had they posted up their dragons by the castle gates and just roasted all-comers, they probably would have saved most everybody who died. I did enjoy the little Batman easter egg, though (the dragons rising above the clouds silouetted by moonlight and dropping down into the darkness). I guess they did manage to knock the NK off his steed, though, which was pretty important.

[Surfah]

One of Cersei's brothers will kill her in keeping with that prophecy. I think it will be Jaime.

The book prophecies clearly don't matter. Mel said green eyes. Arya will kill her.

I just want the Hound to take Beric's sword and use it in Clegane Bowl. That would be amazing.

[Surfah]

One thing the show will have to address is how Dany deals with Jon's legitimate claim to the throne. I wonder if she goes mad queen and Jon kills her. Or maybe Jaime and he is the Queen Slayer too.

[fusnik]

I’m thinking either Cersei wins or there is some sort of statement with no real resolution.

I’m assuming that another NK will be made by Bran or the ferries and the cycle starts again.

Awful military strats, omg, and how awful that after an hour of swinging a heavy sword that all our major warriors are still alive.

Wonder if Tyrion hooks up with Sansa and back stabs Dany.