Terrorism Works

[Moliere]

I find it funny that people bag on the TSA so much. Last time I was in the Atlanta airport I took note of the volume of people that were there either catching a flight or on a layover. The volume of people that get sent through security and screenings is mind-boggling.

For the most part the TSA is a horse and pony show, but that is more a relection of the American people than it is the TSA. After the shoe bomber the American public was concerned about something like that happening again so the TSA now inspects your shoes. That makes the American people more comfortable and it keeps people buying tickets.

[Moliere]

Reactionaries indeed.

Stop and think for a minute how much money we have torched in the form of wasted time and effort* in airport screening and security alone. Then make a liberal guess at how many lives were saved. Suppose we invested that much of our capital in making our highways safer or preventing cancer or heart disease. It is insane.

*No Lingo, I am not arguing for zero security.

But a lot of Americans are already afraid of flying. So if you add an additional concern onto the fear they already have you might end up with people electing to not fly anymore.

It is interesting that a terrorist attack that had nothing to do with explosives brought onto a plan was what caused a lot of the additional safety/screening procedures.

[Surfah]

I find it funny that people bag on the TSA so much. Last time I was in the Atlanta airport I took note of the volume of people that were there either catching a flight or on a layover. The volume of people that get sent through security and screenings is mind-boggling.

For the most part the TSA is a horse and pony show, but that is more a relection of the American people than it is the TSA. After the shoe bomber the American public was concerned about something like that happening again so the TSA now inspects your shoes. That makes the American people more comfortable and it keeps people buying tickets.

The TSA is a joke. I know TSA employees who say it's a joke. There is a fellow in my ward who has been with TSA (he's an architect and got laid off and needed a job and the benefits) for 6 months now. He's a screener and he has yet to receive any sort of security clearance where in his position it is mandatory. He works at Dulles. He also told me that when you travel you should at the very least pack your underwear in plastic bags. He says when they search bags they keep the same latex gloves on all day and just dip their hands into different bags all day. He said it's gross.

[Moliere]

The TSA is a joke. I know TSA employees who say it's a joke. There is a fellow in my ward who has been with TSA (he's an architect and got laid off and needed a job and the benefits) for 6 months now. He's a screener and he has yet to receive any sort of security clearance where in his position it is mandatory. He works at Dulles. He also told me that when you travel you should at the very least pack your underwear in plastic bags. He says when they search bags they keep the same latex gloves on all day and just dip their hands into different bags all day. He said it's gross.

I wouldn't call them a joke, but I will say they are there more for "show" than anything else. The problem is that anytime an attack happens (whether it is effective or not) they react. I think Lebowski pointed this out clearly.

However, what if an attack happened and there was no response from the TSA? Americans would be furious because we are trained to think that something must be done, whether it's the right thing or not it doesn't matter as long as something is done.

Next thing you know someone will sneak in liquid explosives hidden in their breast implants. I can't wait to see what the TSA's reaction would be to that fiasco.

[cowboy]

Just wear these on your flight:



They'll go really well with your cowboy chaps.

They would, but I have to veto the idea because they won't support my spurs.

[Mormon Red Death]

I'll be flying over 70,000 miles in 60+ segments this coming year, and I cringed when I read about the foiled bomber. Flying is going to be a royal poke in the rectum this year.

I have to fly out of DETROIT where this idiot was captured next week.

[byu71]

I am not sure I understand JL. If we don't spend all this time and money on airport security and they blow up a few planes and take a few planes hostage, then terrorism didn't work?

It might be an interesting approach. Maybe when they blew up the towers, we shouldn't have done anyting and just told them, that didn't hurt.

Listening to Ron Paul last night, I kind of think that is his approach.

[Moliere]

Just read through this article:

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-bea...-80233757.html

Every morning I get on a bus that takes me from the park and ride and transports me to my work location. There is no security in regards to the bus at either location. No metal detectors. No body imaging. No pat downs (at least none authorized by the city ) The buses hold 50 passengers, which is less than your normal 737 if flying at capacity but just as many as some smaller jets.

So what's the difference? Why the concern over airplanes and not buses? It's mainly because people are already inherently scared of flying so they want anything to help them feel more secure.

The difference in security protocol for airplanes is mindboggling when compared to buses and trains.

[falafel]

So what's the difference? Why the concern over airplanes and not buses? It's mainly because people are already inherently scared of flying so they want anything to help them feel more secure.

The difference in security protocol for airplanes is mindboggling when compared to buses and trains.

You generally can't take down a 100 story building by ramming a bus into it. I would say that's the difference.

[Jeff Lebowski]

You generally can't take down a 100 story building by ramming a bus into it. I would say that's the difference.

But you see, that's just the thing. Solving the 9-11 problem was almost trivial: lock the cockpit doors. Almost everything else they did was overkill. Like confiscating nail clippers and 4-oz tubes of toothpaste. Or not allowing people to use electronic devices or go to the bathroom during the last hour of flight.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Just read through this article:

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-bea...-80233757.html

Every morning I get on a bus that takes me from the park and ride and transports me to my work location. There is no security in regards to the bus at either location. No metal detectors. No body imaging. No pat downs (at least none authorized by the city ) The buses hold 50 passengers, which is less than your normal 737 if flying at capacity but just as many as some smaller jets.

So what's the difference? Why the concern over airplanes and not buses? It's mainly because people are already inherently scared of flying so they want anything to help them feel more secure.

The difference in security protocol for airplanes is mindboggling when compared to buses and trains.

Bingo. Suppose we employed the same level of security for church, school, buses, trains, ferries, and every other instance in our lives where people are in a group and vulnerable. No one would stand for it. Why do terrorists focus on planes? Because it causes mass hysteria. And that is the entire point of terrorism. A dumbass kid from Africa can cause global panic with a simple low-tech stunt.

[Maximus]

But you see, that's just the thing. Solving the 9-11 problem was almost trivial: lock the cockpit doors. Almost everything else they did was overkill. Like confiscating nail clippers and 4-oz tubes of toothpaste. Or not allowing people to use electronic devices or go to the bathroom during the last hour of flight.

Since there are very easy ways of making bombs with 4 oz or less of liquid, it is not really overkill, is it?

[Moliere]

You generally can't take down a 100 story building by ramming a bus into it. I would say that's the difference.

I'm not worried about someone ramming my plane into a skyscraper. If someone hijacks my plane I'm taking it back. You have a better chance living by fighting back then you do when the plane hits the building. After 9/11 no one should assume they will live throughout an entire highjacking.

People carry large briefcases and even roller bags onto bus/trains everyday. They could do enormous damage with the lack of security that exists in such places. The difference is that people are afraid of flying more so than they are of driving so any bit of safety that can be garnered from security procedures that are overkill (confiscated toenail clippers?) is necessary. Not necessary to actually keep people safe, but necessary to keep people thinking they are safe.

Keep in mind that while planes are safe to fly on, even airlines perform cost/benefit analysis on safety mechanisms and they actually do place a value on a human life when considering to install safety equipment.

[SuperGabers]

Next thing you know someone will sneak in liquid explosives hidden in their breast implants. I can't wait to see what the TSA's reaction would be to that fiasco.

Aren't the x-ray machines now able to see through clothing? It's like porn for the TSA.

[John McClain]

Aren't the x-ray machines now able to see through clothing? It's like porn for the TSA.

That all depends on the person going through the machine! That's one of the reasons I never became an OB-GYN