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  • A question for pelagius

    (and anybody else knowledgeable on the subject).

    Within the last two weeks, I have added in some weightlifting to my exercise regimen. Unlike the running thing (which I'm addicted to now, btw), the root is not for fitness or calorie burning so much as it is for vanity. I would eventually like to work myself to look like one of these gentlemen:



    Or at least get closer than I am now.

    I understand this will take time and effort.

    Do you have any advice as to my approach to weightlifting? I have only what I gleaned during my time in HS lifting for football. I gather that lower weight but higher reps is the way to go - is that true? I also understand that you have to have single-digit body fat percentage to get to that state washboardiness - again, am I just hearing things?

    Right now I am lifting three times a week focusing exclusively on upper body (my legs are sore enough from running). My regimen includes less free weights than I would like, mostly because I am usually working out solo. I am including a significant amount of sit-ups/crunches as well.

    Thoughts?
    Awesomeness now has a name. Let me introduce myself.

  • #2
    Originally posted by nikuman View Post
    Do you have any advice as to my approach to weightlifting? I have only what I gleaned during my time in HS lifting for football. I gather that lower weight but higher reps is the way to go - is that true? I also understand that you have to have single-digit body fat percentage to get to that state washboardiness - again, am I just hearing things?
    Not sure I should really be held up as knowledgeable but here goes anyways since the thread title contains my moniker.

    What do you mean by high rep range? I think there is a place for lots of rep range variation even in a "I am purely lifting to look good nekid" workout.

    In terms of bodyfat. It depends on where you tend to store fat ... Its probably not a bad rule of thumb though particularly if you are measuring with calipers. My guess is the guys in the picture would be in the 10-13% range if they had their body fat measure with DEXA scans but probably sub 10% with a good caliper measurement (or at least that's my general sense from people who do both but there is plenty of idiosyncractic variation since caliper bodyfat calculation is esentially based on regression predictions). They guys in the picture are lean but they don't seem particularly vascular so they are not in the range of freaky conditioning.

    Originally posted by nikuman View Post
    Right now I am lifting three times a week focusing exclusively on upper body (my legs are sore enough from running). My regimen includes less free weights than I would like, mostly because I am usually working out solo. I am including a significant amount of sit-ups/crunches as well.

    Thoughts?
    Hard to tell without some details on exactly what you are doing... My general sense is as long as you lift hard and consistently, in the first 6 months you will make nice gains ... Of course, being in caloric deficit will make it more difficult to make gains.
    Last edited by pelagius; 06-02-2009, 12:07 PM.

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    • #3
      If you're working solo then just work with dumbbells. You can do just as much as you can with a weight in each hand as you can pushing a barbell with a spotter. In fact, in many ways it is superior for what you are trying to achieve because it isolates the muscles much better.

      Just as you have adjusted your diet to lose weight, you need to adjust your diet to build mass. Protein is your friend. You need at the minimum 1 g per lb you weigh. That is tough for most people to do. A 12 oz steak for example has around 100 g give or take. I'd start supplementing with some protein.

      You'll probably gain some weight from this, but once you have built mass then you can start cutting again to trim the fat and expose the muscles you have built.

      Pelagius can help you much more than me. But this is essentially my goal. I want to get down to the weight I want to carry. Bulk back up and then cut again with some maintenance to stay around my goal weight and keep my muscle.
      "Nobody listens to Turtle."
      -Turtle
      sigpic

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      • #4
        Originally posted by nikuman View Post
        Thoughts?
        Brian Austin Green is either Don Juan reincarnated or endowed to an extent unimaginable to mere mortals.
        There's no such thing as luck, only drunken invincibility. Make it happen.

        Tila Tequila and Juggalos, America’s saddest punchline since the South.

        Yesterday was Thursday, Thursday
        Today is Friday, Friday (Partyin’)

        Tomorrow is Saturday
        And Sunday comes afterwards

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        • #5
          Originally posted by landpoke View Post
          Brian Austin Green is either Don Juan reincarnated or endowed to an extent unimaginable to mere mortals.
          Sorry, this probably belongs in The Bedroom.
          There's no such thing as luck, only drunken invincibility. Make it happen.

          Tila Tequila and Juggalos, America’s saddest punchline since the South.

          Yesterday was Thursday, Thursday
          Today is Friday, Friday (Partyin’)

          Tomorrow is Saturday
          And Sunday comes afterwards

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          • #6
            Generally you can't be a runner and look like those guys. I've been really into both and I can testify that to add bulk you can't be doing catabolic activities like running distance, cycling etc... To get six pack lean and keep your bulk you have to keep your cardio to a half hour or less. You won't see Pelagius running for an hour at a time because it just tears down everything he built up.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by SteelBlue View Post
              Generally you can't be a runner and look like those guys. I've been really into both and I can testify that to add bulk you can't be doing catabolic activities like running distance, cycling etc... To get six pack lean and keep your bulk you have to keep your cardio to a half hour or less. You won't see Pelagius running for an hour at a time because it just tears down everything he built up.
              I have read this before, but can you expound? If I want to get rid of the fat around the waist, I need to do cardio, lift weights, and eat at a deficit, no? But I can be doing too much cardio?
              Fitter. Happier. More Productive.

              sigpic

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              • #8
                Originally posted by SteelBlue View Post
                You won't see Pelagius running for an hour at a time because it just tears down everything he built up.
                That and its not very much fun ... If I am cutting then I will do longer cardio stuff but I try to keep it pretty low intensity (although this is my biggest weakness with cutting, I really don't like cardio). I will walk with a greater than 10% incline on the treadmill or even do the elliptical. Actually, I do some running ... I actually do some sprint intervals as part of lower body workouts (we are talking 40-50 meters) sometimes.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by TripletDaddy View Post
                  I have read this before, but can you expound? If I want to get rid of the fat around the waist, I need to do cardio, lift weights, and eat at a deficit, no? But I can be doing too much cardio?
                  Intense running makes it hard to for me to recover so there is a spill over effect into my lifting. I might still be sore, CNS worn down, etc, etc. It can become counterproductive.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by SteelBlue View Post
                    Generally you can't be a runner and look like those guys. I've been really into both and I can testify that to add bulk you can't be doing catabolic activities like running distance, cycling etc... To get six pack lean and keep your bulk you have to keep your cardio to a half hour or less. You won't see Pelagius running for an hour at a time because it just tears down everything he built up.
                    I echo DDD's question when I ask why that is? If that is the case (and I have no reason to doubt that it is) then I'd rather keep with the running. Meaning that I will keep weight training but for the original reason I started it: to keep my upper body as fit as my lower body has gotten with running. Also, having a ripped torso isn't going to help me run 26.2 miles in January.

                    Pelagius, to answer your question (and because I'm too lazy to multi-quote) I am doing at least three sets of 25 on any given exercise, the idea being that the last reps should be just about all I can muster. And I am using dumbbells (both at home and at the gym) because my understanding is that free weights of any sort are much more beneficial in that the balancing component has a real effect.
                    Awesomeness now has a name. Let me introduce myself.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by pelagius View Post
                      Intense running makes it hard to for me to recover so there is a spill over effect into my lifting. I might still be sore, CNS worn down, etc, etc. It can become counterproductive.
                      I do the machine for about an hour at a time. Unlike you, I enjoy the cardio (my cholesterol test is this week!).

                      But it seems that before you can get cut on your abs, you need to remove almost all of the fat. How can cardio be counterproductive to that? Or is cardio counterproductive to building massive pecs and biceps (which I would not say that the guys in Nik's pic are massive)? Abs seem to be a fairly easy muscle group to build. The challenge is shedding the fat, not building the ab.

                      I want to make sure I am not making it harder to get rid of the stomach. I wonder if I should do less cardio?

                      Another elephant in the room....genetics. Aren't some people simply not wired to have a 6 pack?
                      Fitter. Happier. More Productive.

                      sigpic

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                      • #12
                        Also, is a DEXA scan or other body fat measurement something that a gym would have, or am I looking at a medical professional? The online calculators based on body measurements have me anywhere from 14% to 19%, but I'm not even sure about that because I do carry fat different than most men (I don't get a pot gut; I do get a booty) and I do have a largish frame.

                        Would calipers get thrown off by the fact that I have extra skin that is shrinking back in a few places?
                        Awesomeness now has a name. Let me introduce myself.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by nikuman View Post
                          Pelagius, to answer your question (and because I'm too lazy to multi-quote) I am doing at least three sets of 25 on any given exercise, the idea being that the last reps should be just about all I can muster. And I am using dumbbells (both at home and at the gym) because my understanding is that free weights of any sort are much more beneficial in that the balancing component has a real effect.
                          Well, I think there is a place for 25 reps but my understanding is that in peer reviewed journals a rep range of 6-12 consistently produces the most overall hypertrophy.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by nikuman View Post
                            Also, is a DEXA scan or other body fat measurement something that a gym would have, or am I looking at a medical professional? The online calculators based on body measurements have me anywhere from 14% to 19%, but I'm not even sure about that because I do carry fat different than most men (I don't get a pot gut; I do get a booty) and I do have a largish frame.

                            Would calipers get thrown off by the fact that I have extra skin that is shrinking back in a few places?
                            Nikuman go hit up the bod pods. Most Colleges and Universities have them, it is usually only $10-$15 to get tested. BYU and the U of U both have them. I have a friend I work with who got down to 12% body fat per the Calipers (he is about 6'6 and weighed about 235) But per the bod pod he was actually 18%.

                            Not sure how close any of these are to you but there are a lot of Universities in Texas that have them.

                            http://www.bodpod.com/clients/usClients
                            *Banned*

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by TripletDaddy View Post
                              I do the machine for about an hour at a time. Unlike you, I enjoy the cardio (my cholesterol test is this week!).

                              But it seems that before you can get cut on your abs, you need to remove almost all of the fat. How can cardio be counterproductive to that? Or is cardio counterproductive to building massive pecs and biceps (which I would not say that the guys in Nik's pic are massive)? Abs seem to be a fairly easy muscle group to build. The challenge is shedding the fat, not building the ab.

                              I want to make sure I am not making it harder to get rid of the stomach. I wonder if I should do less cardio?

                              Another elephant in the room....genetics. Aren't some people simply not wired to have a 6 pack?
                              I think steel's comment was more pointed towards the 6-pack abs AND the broad, ripped chest and bulging arms. Make no-mistake--the more cardio you do, the more ripped your abs will get. But ripped abs look so much more impressive when they are surrounded by a toned chest and bulging arms.
                              Prepare to put mustard on those words, for you will soon be consuming them, along with this slice of humble pie that comes direct from the oven of shame set at gas mark “egg on your face”! -- Moss

                              There are three rules that I live by: never get less than twelve hours sleep; never play cards with a guy who has the same first name as a city; and never get involved with a woman with a tattoo of a dagger on her body. Now you stick to that, and everything else is cream cheese. --Coach Finstock

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