Corporations and universities suing high schools over logo infringement

[Parrot Head]

This could fit into several categories and I'd be interested to hear what the CUF legal counsel think (though I think there's a lot more to discuss from the business/marketing/pr side). It's a good read and looks at Chrysler playing hardball with a high school, as well as Texas and others.

Promotion or Piracy: Logo Issues on the Rise

While high school athletic teams have long borrowed the logos of college or professional teams for decades - who doesn't remember a school with helmets that look awfully familiar to a college or pro team? - enforcement of registered trademarks is a rather new phenomenon.

I can easily state that our high school "Golden Demon" was not a stolen design. Or one that anyone wanted to wear.

[creekster]

This could fit into several categories and I'd be interested to hear what the CUF legal counsel think (though I think there's a lot more to discuss from the business/marketing/pr side). It's a good read and looks at Chrysler playing hardball with a high school, as well as Texas and others.

Promotion or Piracy: Logo Issues on the Rise



I can easily state that our high school "Golden Demon" was not a stolen design. Or one that anyone wanted to wear.

Once again the Jordan Beet Diggers find out just how odd they are.

[ewth8tr]

BYU recently went after some small high school as well.
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=181&f=2336&t=6232711&p=2

[thesaint258]

I haven't done a ton with trademark law, but I think the article is right in that companies or bigger sports teams are pretty much required to take action if they want to protect their trademark. I also agree that entering into a licensing agreement for a nominal fee or a small percentage of anything sold with the logo is a better way to go than pursuing litigation. Of course, if a school refuses to work with a company or team, they pretty much have to sue.

[wuapinmon]

Public schools should have a public license to use the logos of whomever. They aren't for profit.

[Top Ute]

I haven't done a ton with trademark law, but I think the article is right in that companies or bigger sports teams are pretty much required to take action if they want to protect their trademark. I also agree that entering into a licensing agreement for a nominal fee or a small percentage of anything sold with the logo is a better way to go than pursuing litigation. Of course, if a school refuses to work with a company or team, they pretty much have to sue.

Gotta call bull on this. I'm not saying you're wrong from a legal perspective, but why is it only universities that are going after high schools? Pro teams' logos are often "copied" by high school teams, yet you don't see the Green Bay Packers laying the hammer down on high school teams.

Schools take plays, musicals, etc. and perform them before the public, often for a cost. Have the original composers of those works (or their heirs or estates) come down on the schools and demanded them to pony up? Yes, I know there's a significantly lesser time for those kinds of works to be protected, but shouldn't it fall under fair use? Of course it does, because it's for clearly educational purposes. So is the high school teams' usage of these logos.

If the university athletic departments are demanding that their logos be protected in the same vein as GM, that's a slippery slope, because then they're exposing themselves as a for-profit entity, and last I checked, for-profit entities are not entitled to the tax-exempt status that the NCAA and its members have. And if the universities lose that exemption, you can kiss college sports as we know it goodbye.

[cougjunkie]

Gotta call bull on this. I'm not saying you're wrong from a legal perspective, but why is it only universities that are going after high schools? Pro teams' logos are often "copied" by high school teams, yet you don't see the Green Bay Packers laying the hammer down on high school teams.

Schools take plays, musicals, etc. and perform them before the public, often for a cost. Have the original composers of those works (or their heirs or estates) come down on the schools and demanded them to pony up? Yes, I know there's a significantly lesser time for those kinds of works to be protected, but shouldn't it fall under fair use? Of course it does, because it's for clearly educational purposes. So is the high school teams' usage of these logos.

If the university athletic departments are demanding that their logos be protected in the same vein as GM, that's a slippery slope, because then they're exposing themselves as a for-profit entity, and last I checked, for-profit entities are not entitled to the tax-exempt status that the NCAA and its members have. And if the universities lose that exemption, you can kiss college sports as we know it goodbye.

I am curious about teams like for example the Payson Lions they have the same colors (Green and White) as the New York Jets and all of their uniforms, the font, logs etc look just like the Jets but they say Lions on them instead. Clearly they copied everything about the Jets but they are the Lions.

Can they get in trouble for that?

[CardiacCoug]

BYU recently went after some small high school as well.
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=181&f=2336&t=6232711&p=2

I would love to see an actual news link for that story -- I doubt BYU would actually go after a high school in Oklahoma for trademark infringement.

[Katy Lied]

Sorta funny story. There is a local high school that copies the exact logo of a WAC school, everything is the same except for the substitution of the high school name for the college name.

So I was over visiting my best friend, and I was on her Facebook account posing as her (she was trying to convince me to create a FB account and wanted to show me how it worked) when a FB text comes in by some guy who is extremely outraged about this small school in Utah who has copied their college logo, and he wants my friend's husband to go midieval on them (husband is the AD) and he persistently kept texting me wanting my assurance that I would take this to the higher ups.

So, nothing ever came of it.

[thesaint258]

Gotta call bull on this. I'm not saying you're wrong from a legal perspective, but why is it only universities that are going after high schools? Pro teams' logos are often "copied" by high school teams, yet you don't see the Green Bay Packers laying the hammer down on high school teams.

Schools take plays, musicals, etc. and perform them before the public, often for a cost. Have the original composers of those works (or their heirs or estates) come down on the schools and demanded them to pony up? Yes, I know there's a significantly lesser time for those kinds of works to be protected, but shouldn't it fall under fair use? Of course it does, because it's for clearly educational purposes. So is the high school teams' usage of these logos.

If the university athletic departments are demanding that their logos be protected in the same vein as GM, that's a slippery slope, because then they're exposing themselves as a for-profit entity, and last I checked, for-profit entities are not entitled to the tax-exempt status that the NCAA and its members have. And if the universities lose that exemption, you can kiss college sports as we know it goodbye.

Well, it could be because the NFL is better at licensing than the NCAA. (I've heard that the Collegiate Licensing Company leaves more up to the NCAA teams than the NFL leaves to its teams, but I don't know much more than that, and I could be wrong.) Further, I don't know how other schools do their musicals, but I know at Alta, they paid to use the music and scripts. They didn't just find the music or script online and use it. I assume other schools do the same. All entities, either for-profit or non-profit, have an interesting in making sure they're the only ones who use their trademarks.

[PaloAltoCougar]

...
Schools take plays, musicals, etc. and perform them before the public, often for a cost. Have the original composers of those works (or their heirs or estates) come down on the schools and demanded them to pony up? Yes, I know there's a significantly lesser time for those kinds of works to be protected, but shouldn't it fall under fair use? Of course it does, because it's for clearly educational purposes. So is the high school teams' usage of these logos.

Actually, schools and churches cannot perform copyrighted plays and musicals without having first obtained a license from the copyright owner, and such owners have often been pretty aggressive in protecting their IP. See, e.g., http://www.musicals101.com/alphinde.htm

A few years back, our stake was about to put on a production of musical highlights from Les Miserables, and I had been coerced at gunpoint to perform the role of the besotted innkeeper, Thernardier. Tickets to the event were free, but even at that were grossly overpriced. Mercifully, the legal gods descended upon us and demanded either (a) a license fee, or (b) that we cease and desist from the performance. Thankfully, the decisionmakers opted for the latter.

[Surfah]

Actually, schools and churches cannot perform copyrighted plays and musicals without having first obtained a license from the copyright owner, and such owners have often been pretty aggressive in protecting their IP. See, e.g., http://www.musicals101.com/alphinde.htm

A few years back, our stake was about to put on a production of musical highlights from Les Miserables, and I had been coerced at gunpoint to perform the role of the besotted innkeeper, Thernardier. Tickets to the event were free, but even at that were grossly overpriced. Mercifully, the legal gods descended upon us and demanded either (a) a license fee, or (b) that we cease and desist from the performance. Thankfully, the decisionmakers opted for the latter.

PAC as Thernardier. It's all making sense.

[Tim]

Public schools should have a public license to use the logos of whomever. They aren't for profit.

High schools sell merchandise with their logos on them, though. If they're using a trademarked logo without permission and then turning around and selling merchandise with that logo on it, they should have to pay royalties.

[wuapinmon]

High schools sell merchandise with their logos on them, though. If they're using a trademarked logo without permission and then turning around and selling merchandise with that logo on it, they should have to pay royalties.

You're right, legally, but we're talking about a high school program that isn't for profit and feeds the teams with players. I think that public schools should have a special status. They're not making millions on selling t-shirts. All that money goes back into the sport. Having to license stuff just takes money away from the program to rich schools that don't need the money. A few hundred to Georgetown is nothing, but a few hundred to Darlington High School is quite a lot.

Of course, I hate copyright law.

[landpoke]

Of course, I hate copyright law.

Because it keeps you from passing off articles from obscure Latin American literary journals as your own?