How about a massive temporary tax raise?

[RobinFinderson]

Think about how much money we have spent on the military and the current hot wars. We do this in the name of national defense, and most Republicans feel that this is one of the few government programs that is worth the cost. Well our debt is another problem that is damaging national security, and it wouldn't matter how much we were to lower spending, without raising taxes, this debt is going to continue to harm us for decades.

So lets get rid of the debt. Anyone who is serious about getting rid of the debt needs to be willing to approach the problem as both a matter of spending and revenues. Taxes are the revenues, so we MUST raise them. Lets call it a 'patriots tax,' since it is going to happen temporarily, with a clearly defined stopping point, and it will only exist for the purpose of paying down the national debt to a manageable level.

[Indy Coug]

How much and for how long? Would this be the best time to pull that trigger, given the overall state of the economy?

[jay santos]

Think about how much money we have spent on the military and the current hot wars. We do this in the name of national defense, and most Republicans feel that this is one of the few government programs that is worth the cost. Well our debt is another problem that is damaging national security, and it wouldn't matter how much we were to lower spending, without raising taxes, this debt is going to continue to harm us for decades.

So lets get rid of the debt. Anyone who is serious about getting rid of the debt needs to be willing to approach the problem as both a matter of spending and revenues. Taxes are the revenues, so we MUST raise them. Lets call it a 'patriots tax,' since it is going to happen temporarily, with a clearly defined stopping point, and it will only exist for the purpose of paying down the national debt to a manageable level.

National debt is really not as big of a deal as some think.



http://zfacts.com/metaPage/lib/National-Debt-GDP-L.gif (image embedding didn't work wonder why)

I don't know if this chart is trustworthy as I pulled it off a website with political agenda, but this is similar to figures I've seen before.

You see how it went down significantly under Clinton. A fiscally responsible government and a good economy will bring down the debt pretty quickly.

It's like you owing a year's worth of salary on your house. You pay the interest on it each month and it's a pain, but it doesn't kill you.

[thesaint258]

Well, the fact that the increases probably wouldn't be temporary is an issue for me. For example, California raised taxes promising that the increase was just going to be temporary to help out. I remember seeing an article where the government said they were going to have to extend the increase. If the increase does eventually get reduced, I bet it will take a long time before it actually happens. If the same thing happens on a national level, it won't help control spending or pay down the debt. The government will see all this new money coming in and use it to pay for other things. It wouldn't be temporary, and it would just make the problem worse.

[dabrockster]

I'm for a flat tax for all. 10 to 11 % across the board.. I would much rather see it below 10% but I can handle it..

I guess my hesitancy is that we have yet to see any cuts. All I have seen is spending. So if they are spending NOW without raising any taxes. What the hell would they do when they raised taxes??

I saw first hand what the city of Columbus did this past year when they raised taxes to "save" the fireman and police officers jobs and to hire more. They cut them anyway and used the extra funds elsewhere..

So I am not to trusting of govt to do the right thing..

[happyone]

The temporary part of this is an issue for me also. For example, they just got around, in the last 5 yrs or so, to taking a temp tax off of telephones that was used to pay for the Spanish American war.

edit - it was 2006 http://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...hone-tax_x.htm

[beefytee]

Robin is this some joke about the introduction of the "temporary" income tax to pay for the civil war?

[Uncle Ted]

If they government decided to do a "massive [significant] temporary tax" increase I would most likely put the brakes on earning income and maybe take a long vacation in a place like Costa Rica to live the simple life on the beach. If my income taxes jumped to, say, 70% or more then I wouldn't have much of incentive to earn income and would rather just harvest coconuts and barter with monkeys.

[dabrockster]

Hey Robin. Looks like Rep. Steny Hoyer is looking at such an option.. Or at least beginning to tip the toe in that area..


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...104708_pf.html

[Mormon Red Death]

Think about how much money we have spent on the military and the current hot wars. We do this in the name of national defense, and most Republicans feel that this is one of the few government programs that is worth the cost. Well our debt is another problem that is damaging national security, and it wouldn't matter how much we were to lower spending, without raising taxes, this debt is going to continue to harm us for decades.

So lets get rid of the debt. Anyone who is serious about getting rid of the debt needs to be willing to approach the problem as both a matter of spending and revenues. Taxes are the revenues, so we MUST raise them. Lets call it a 'patriots tax,' since it is going to happen temporarily, with a clearly defined stopping point, and it will only exist for the purpose of paying down the national debt to a manageable level.

If we do that then lets do a temporary furlough of all government employees and services. maybe a week long furlough without any pay.

[dabrockster]

If we do that then lets do a temporary furlough of all government employees and services. maybe a week long furlough without any pay.

In fact I think they should go further. 2 weeks.. This is what exactly many states had to do. Including me.. 2 weeks without pay each year for the next 2 years...

[byu71]

I might be open to a one time tax, as long as everyone gets hit by it.

Also, they would have to have something in the bill that said if the tax hike was extended more than two years, the current leadership, Obama, Reid and Pelosi would be deballed in public.

[RobinFinderson]

How much and for how long? Would this be the best time to pull that trigger, given the overall state of the economy?

I don't know that there is ever a really good time to increase taxes. During prosperous times the argument is that a tax increase will pop the prosperity bubble. At least during an economic downturn there isn't as far to fall. In some ways an economic lull is good for entrepreneurship. People who would otherwise sit tight on a good job will consider building small businesses when they get laid off from the big companies that get hit by the tax increase. Maybe it slows down the recovery, or maybe it is a wash, but I don't think that it would be absolutely devastating either.

The temporary part of this is an issue for me also.

Well, the fact that the increases probably wouldn't be temporary is an issue for me.

I think you would have to write a strong law that ensures that the tax will ONLY apply to the debt, and place a trigger that automatically ends the tax once the debt has been lowered to some acceptable percent of GDP.

If they government decided to do a "massive [significant] temporary tax" increase I would most likely put the brakes on earning income and maybe take a long vacation in a place like Costa Rica to live the simple life on the beach. If my income taxes jumped to, say, 70% or more then I wouldn't have much of incentive to earn income and would rather just harvest coconuts and barter with monkeys.

If we accept the conservative line of thinking as a fact, that the national debt damages national security, then this tax would be tantamount to a call to arms to fight an economic war. In times past, honorable men from families of privilege would enlist to fight wars when called upon by their country. This would be similar, a call to patriots everywhere to sacrifice a bit more to help the country. You would be like the draft dodgers that skipped to Canada. I'd say good riddance, and write a law that prevented you from returning to the states for dereliction of duty.

I might be open to a one time tax, as long as everyone gets hit by it.

Well as long as everyone is debating HOW to raise taxes, as opposed to whether they need to be raised, then that would be a matter for the people and the Congress to figure out. Like paying tithing, I think that it would be a great idea for EVERYONE to have the opportunity to contribute to this Patriots' Tax, and know that they had done their part. The second consideration would be a matter of pragmatism -- we would have to tax the wealthy more simply because taxing the poor isn't going to get us out of debt.

[beelzebabette]

I don't know that there is ever a really good time to increase taxes. During prosperous times the argument is that a tax increase will pop the prosperity bubble. At least during an economic downturn there isn't as far to fall.

I almost stopped reading here, but I'm glad I plowed through.

I think you would have to write a strong law that ensures that the tax will ONLY apply to the debt, and place a trigger that automatically ends the tax once the debt has been lowered to some acceptable percent of GDP.

I'm assuming you also mean that the budget has to be balanced before this can occur, or you've just created an end-around to a permanent tax increase.

If we accept the conservative line of thinking as a fact, that the national debt damages national security, then this tax would be tantamount to a call to arms to fight an economic war. In times past, honorable men from families of privilege would enlist to fight wars when called upon by their country. This would be similar, a call to patriots everywhere to sacrifice a bit more to help the country. You would be like the draft dodgers that skipped to Canada. I'd say good riddance, and write a law that prevented you from returning to the states for dereliction of duty.

(We really need another emoticon.)

[Uncle Ted]

If we accept the conservative line of thinking as a fact, that the national debt damages national security, then this tax would be tantamount to a call to arms to fight an economic war. In times past, honorable men from families of privilege would enlist to fight wars when called upon by their country. This would be similar, a call to patriots everywhere to sacrifice a bit more to help the country. You would be like the draft dodgers that skipped to Canada. I'd say good riddance, and write a law that prevented you from returning to the states for dereliction of duty.

What makes you think I would stop paying income taxes from Costa Rica or some other country? I would just be cutting my expenses by moving to a lower cost of living country to live but as a citizen of the United States I would have to still pay income taxes. Of course, in Costa Rica I would most likely have a lot less income. So there is a trade off.

And who exactly would this "call to arms" go out to? Just the 53% that pay income taxes?